Steve Khouw
A refugee who fled Indonesia at 9 now advocates for migrants exploited by platforms and men at risk of suicide, driven by his parents' conviction that freedom matters.
Hear this story
Steve Khouw was nine years old when tanks rolled up to his house in 1960s Indonesia. His family, ethnic Chinese, were marked as communist sympathizers by the Suharto regime. When soldiers shot their dog, his parents knew it was time to leave. They fled to Singapore, then Australia, carrying almost nothing but his father's conviction: freedom at last, freedom of expression.
His father, a lawyer, could only get one year of his qualification recognised in Australia. Instead of finishing his degree, he took multiple jobs to feed three kids and pay three mortgages on a $14,000 house. His mother sewed boardshorts for 50 cents each, retail for $20. The family stuck envelope labels until 2am before school. Steve arrived at an Australian primary school speaking no English, shocked by how students talked back to teachers. But that same freedom to challenge authority freed something in him. When kids called him a cow at the gate, he learned to stand his ground. Nine times out of ten, they backed down.
Steve carried his parents' values into adulthood: take the best from each culture, throw away the rest. He worked as a mining engineer, marketer, coal seller, green building designer. He became a food delivery rider to stay fit and discovered migrant riders being exploited by platforms with no safety protections or compensation. He advocated for them. He started preventing male suicide, a crisis that claims six out of every eight Australian lives lost each day. In his frontline work, he encounters two to three cases a month.
Now Steve speaks about freedom the way his father did. He takes elderly people for walks. He pushes back against racism, quietly and directly. He calls himself true blue Australian, and he means it.
⚠️ Content advisory: this episode discusses abuse & exploitation and suicide & self-harm prevention, which some listeners may find distressing.
If you need support, you're not alone. Help is available: • Blue Knot Foundation (complex trauma): 1300 657 380 · blueknot.org.au • 1800RESPECT (family, domestic & sexual violence): 1800 737 732 · 1800respect.org.au • Lifeline (24/7 crisis support): 13 11 14 · lifeline.org.au
“I stood my ground verbally and physically. I wouldn't let them have the best of me. And you know what happened? They backed down. 9 out of 10 Aussies backed down.”
“It's hope. H-O-P-E. Hope. Hope for the nation, for Australia. Hope for the community. Hope for the family, the new generations, second and third generation, fourth even.”
“Empathy is literally putting yourself in the shoes of the other person. And the only way you can practice empathy is like method acting, you know, you be like them or be exposed, go to where they are, hang out with these people, and then you'll understand what it's like.”
The hero, today
Steve's father created an Indonesian name that was a coded protest against the forced erasure of their Chinese identity, then immediately reverted to his original Hokkien name once he became an Australian citizen and felt safe. When Steve stood his ground against racism and bullying at school, whether verbally or physically, nine out of ten times the other person backed down, teaching him that how you respond to aggression determines whether you become an easy target. Steve works with food delivery riders, most of them migrants or international students, who are exploited by platforms with no compensation or safety protections and don't understand local laws or how to respond when they face racism. Steve moves through life by taking the best from Chinese culture, Indonesian experience, and Australian grit, and deliberately rejecting what is bad from each, rather than trying to preserve any single identity whole. Steve's parents gave their children freedom to choose their own paths while instilling hope they could succeed, avoiding the undue pressure he sees other Asian families place on their children to achieve specific outcomes. Six out of every eight Australians who die by suicide are men, and Steve encounters two to three cases monthly in his frontline advocacy work, which has driven him to pursue political involvement to stop what he calls this carnage.
Yes. Steve Khouw is a real person who shared their own story in their own words. Kintsugi Heroes is a not-for-profit that shares first-person stories of overcoming adversity, told with the person's consent.
Kintsugi Heroes, a registered Australian not-for-profit. Every story is shared with the hero's own consent and reviewed under Kintsugi Heroes' trauma-informed content standard before it goes public.
Steve's father created an Indonesian name that was a coded protest against the forced erasure of their Chinese identity, then immediately reverted to his original Hokkien name once he became an Australian citizen and felt safe.
When Steve stood his ground against racism and bullying at school, whether verbally or physically, nine out of ten times the other person backed down, teaching him that how you respond to aggression determines whether you become an easy target.
Steve works with food delivery riders, most of them migrants or international students, who are exploited by platforms with no compensation or safety protections and don't understand local laws or how to respond when they face racism.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 00:15
Hello and welcome to the podcast From There to Here, a podcast brought to life with Kintsugi Heroes. I'm your host, Emma Bellamy, and each week we will dive into conversations with people who get what it takes to rebuild a life away from home. Today, my guest is Steve Ko. Steve is an Australia-based immigrant who left Indonesia as a child due to risks of persecution. In this episode, Steve takes us on a journey through vivid memories of his situation back in Indonesia and the challenges he's faced due to his ethnicity. He shares the hardships he tackled as an immigrant, the mindset and values that fueled his life, and the inspiring advocacy work he's doing to help fellow immigrants. If you are up for a story packed with heart, grit, and resilience, stick around. This episode will likely resonate with you. Steve Coe, welcome. I'm delighted to have you on the podcast.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 01:31
Well, thank you for having me.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 01:33
So today we are going to explore your story and insights as an Australia-based immigrant. But what I'd like you to do is start, uh, right at the beginning. I know that you left Indonesia as a child. You were about 9. So I wonder whether you remember what was life like for you over there?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 01:55
Oh yes. I guess I have vivid memories. Some of it are trauma-based, others are pleasant stuff, and I don't try to block it away. Yes. I remember a lot of stuff, mostly a lot of conflicts in Indonesia at that time. Remember, this is in the 1960s, very much an era of political conflict everywhere you go, especially For us, our family, we are ethnic Chinese. And in the 1960s, there's this issue about anti-communism by the new Suharto regime. And they pick on us. They accuse us of being communist sympathizers and all that kind of stuff. I can feel it. Even though I was just a child, I can feel the tension in my parents and in the household and among the whole clan, actually. I asked my dad once, why are we called Khasidi? We had to change our name to an Indonesian name, you know. We can't have our Chinese name. We can't even have Chinese newspaper. We cannot write in Chinese. That's how terrible it was. We were being marginalized. And my dad says, oh, you know, we just have to. And later on, I found out our Indonesian name is Karsidi, K-A-R-S-I-D-I. He coined it on a play of words. Kasidi came from the Indonesian word "suka," which means difficult, hardship. Sidi means very sad, melancholic. So what he's trying to tell the Indonesian authority is that you're imposing hardship on us because we had to give up our heritage, our culture, anything to do with being Chinese. But they didn't get it, right? And as soon as he became Australian citizen in 1978, he reverted back to our original Hokkien Chinese name, Koh. Wow.
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Steve moves through life by taking the best from Chinese culture, Indonesian experience, and Australian grit, and deliberately rejecting what is bad from each, rather than trying to preserve any single identity whole.
This conversation includes tanks at the gate, a name that meant hardship, poor but free, three mortgages and shift work, culture shock at school and the cow and the gate.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 03:46
That you waited a very long time to actually revert your name back.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 03:50
He was very certain that we need to be sure that we are true blue Aussie, Aussie, Aussie before we can revert back. 'Cause if we don't, if we end up back in Indonesia, then we can be persecuted. Wow.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 04:03
My gosh. And do you remember how you left? Like the day you left with your parents?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 04:09
Oh yes. This comes from the stories that my parents shared with my siblings and myself. And what I understand, it was such a hurry. We had to get out. Mom was, in today's parlance, would be called an activist. She likes to take care of the vulnerable, the poor and the downtrodden, that kind of stuff. And Dad does the same thing. He was a lawyer back in Indonesia. So he's more like a community lawyer. He actually does a lot of free stuff for his friends and members of the public. And what happened is that they're kind of trying to pin us as members of the Communist Party, the PKI, as it's called back then. And eventually when the tanks start rolling in in front of our house, there's two tanks there pointing their turret at me. And I was just a little kid, you know, 5, 6, 7-year-old. And I said, oh, this is fun. But when they shot at the German Shepherd dog that we had. That's it. You know, the mate took us in and that was it. We fled to Singapore first and then get our paper in order and finally we were accepted to be immigrants into Australia. And I can see the change in my parents' attitude. You know, the happiness just went proper, just all the way because we are safe in Australia. Now, and this is it. Dad was always talking about freedom at last, freedom of expression. We can say what we want without being persecuted. And that's what creates this empathy in my being about freedom. You gotta love it, you gotta protect it. And to this very day, I'm into freedom. If it wasn't for freedom, we couldn't express ourselves, right? Wow.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 05:54
It's funny that you have still the memories of your parents arriving in Australia and feeling super safe and and free and you, you still remember that.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 06:04
Oh yes. Yes. But it was short-lived happiness, you know. Um, we were poor. We left essentially with the shirt on our back. We, we had a few little possessions here and there, but that was it. And we had to find a shelter. Dad didn't have enough money, um, uh, for the deposit, despite getting loans from relatives and all stuff. So he had to have not one, not two, but 3 loans. I remember their house was only worth $14,000 in the 1970s when they bought it. Can you imagine? It's probably worth about $2 million by now, right? But even though he couldn't afford it, he had 3 mortgages on it. And so Mom and Dad had to work their guts out. They had multiple jobs. Dad was a lawyer. He wanted to become a lawyer in Australia, but he couldn't because, you know, it's a bit traditional. Provider and protector of his family. He only get 1 year of a 4-year law degree accredited, so he had to do 3 years of study. And in the meantime, you know, he just said, who's gonna feed the kids? They had to go straight to work.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 07:08
So he gave up on becoming a lawyer?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 07:10
He did.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 07:11
He had to. Wow. That must have been very hard for him.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 07:14
It was his passion, but he got back into it in, in as, as an amateur, basically. He helped a lot of people. In so many different ways. I mean, when he died in the funeral, there's all these people that me and my brothers and sisters never knew. And they went, they came and they said, "If it wasn't for your dad, we wouldn't be here. And we want to thank you for helping us, our family." I didn't know what he did, but he used to do it for free. And we are forever poor in our, that's my beginning in my life.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 07:50
When you arrived, did you and your family spoke English at the time?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 07:54
No, except for my dad. My dad, he can speak multiple language. I lost count how many language he can speak fluently. He was educated in a Dutch school in Indonesia. Dutch occupied, sorry, they colonized Indonesia, and so did mom. So they can speak Dutch, but Dad's English is perfect from the very beginning, but mom can't speak a word of English, so she struggled to get a job. So I remember she's an excellent seamstress, she can sew really well, a direct trade, mainly the Jewish families who owns all this fashion business. She get like thousands of these board shorts and shirts and she has to and sold them and she get like 50 cents, 70 cents each and they retail for $20. I mean, in those days, $20, probably $120 now, right? She gets 50, 70 cents each. That's what we had to do to survive. Dad had multiple jobs. He was very clever to start off as a, as a clerk, graduate clerk, and then work his way up until he became a mill employee, you know, in a flour mill just next to our school. Yeah. But even though, you know, he was doing shift work, so we hardly see him as well. I remember we had to, even the kids, there were 3 of us at the time when we first came to Australia. I remember we had to stick all these envelope labels. We had to stay up until 1 or 2 in the morning getting it done because it's due the next day, the next morning. And then get to sleep around 3 in the morning and then we go to school the next day, you know. That's how we make money.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 09:40
Hmm. And I wonder whether you have memories of you arriving in school, because I'm assuming you're 9, you don't speak any English and you have to go to school. How was it like for you?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 09:52
Oh, it was a culture shock, big time. You were accustomed to going to school in Indonesia where everything is kind of like, um, pretty much regimented and you can expect the unexpected, that kind of stuff. But here in Australia, what gets me the most was the unruliness of the kids. They're out of control. I mean, they were very disrespectful to the teachers. They talk back and they just pay no attention. I said, how can you do that? I mean, we were taught to respect those in authorities, the teachers, the police, and the government, all that kind of stuff. But in some way it frees me up. It provides the creativity within me to be able to express myself, to express my opinions and my ideas, and also to explore beyond what they taught at school. I can't explain it. It's just, you just accept the good and reject the bad whenever you go to a new environment.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 10:52
I'm trying to picture you, you know, in the school system. Was it easy to make friends?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 10:58
Yeah, the good and the bad, huh? I make friends because of my personality. I love connecting. It's important to me, this sense of belonging. But on the other side of the fence, I was horrendously subjected to a lot of racism and discrimination, subtle to direct. Subtle like, you know, my surname is Koh. It's a Hokkien way of calling. Actually, my real name is Xu in Mandarin, but Koh is my surname. And then, you know, you walk in the classroom, someone will have to say, "Oh, here comes the cow. Shut the gate." Oh no. Yeah, they did that. And, you know, like having a go. But this is, in some way, this is the Aussie way. They try to get you. You have to have thick skin. So I've learned a lot about racism accordingly and how to deal with it. When I work in the coal mines eventually as a mining engineer, they call me Bing Lee because there's a store called Bing Lee in Australia. And they used to sing a song, I like Bing Lee, on the phone, you know? So what I did was just I give them back what they deserve. If they give me a hard time, I give them a hard time. And this is the issue with migrants of today, especially Asian migrants. When a typical Aussie have a go at them, they just become very withdrawn and even say, "Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hurt your feeling," that kind of stuff. Well, I don't do that. I give them back what they gave me. You know, I stand up.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 12:39
How do you do that?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 12:40
Well, I just stood my ground verbally and physically. I wouldn't let them have the best of me. And you know what happened? They backed down. 9 out of 10 Aussies backed down.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 12:52
I think it's also about human nature. I think that if you are bullied, but you stand up for yourself and you don't take it, people's attitude change around you. And if you look like you are really affected by it, I think that you become more of an easy target.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 13:10
Well, that's just it. This is the issue at hand today when I'm now very much into advocacy. To prevent racism from festering in Australia. I don't think we are a racist country actually. It's just that there, in every bunch of, you know, a bunch of apples, say, there's always one bad apple, right? Or two.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 13:31
Yeah.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 13:31
Right. And you need to deal with those. You really have to, uh, in an Australian context where it's like, it's a, it's supposed to be an egalitarian society. You, you need to be able to stand up. If you don't stand up, you get cut down. But this is the way Australia had been in the colonial days to the present day. That's how they survived. They become a very strong nation being able to just move forward despite the hardship. And the good thing about it is that after the Second World War, the immigrants start coming in, in droves, and they're the one who actually spearhead this get up and go kind of greedy attitude. Much more than I see the average bear, if you know what I mean.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 14:14
Mm. Well, I think you don't have the choice, I guess. When you arrive as a migrant, you have to do everything on your own. You really have to fight for establishing your life. So, you know, you have to change your mindset. If you didn't have that in you, I think the context bring it out of you, you know?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 14:31
Absolutely. The thing is, the migrants, when they come here, especially on humanitarian grounds, They have to succeed for their sake, their family, their community, and intergenerational. They have to, especially the Asian migrants, those who had been colored by Confucianism and Buddhism and all those Eastern kind of philosophies where family is paramount and the next generation is paramount. That's why You know, hard to explain, but I, I have to take care of my parents' graves. I know all society does it, but even more so to the Chinese folks as a matter of gratitude and thanksgiving for what they've done for us.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 15:20
So there was a bit of a pressure in your family that you, you needed to succeed. Did you felt that pressure?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 15:27
Well, uh, my family, uh, my parents in particular were quite liberal. Um, in that sense, because they didn't want to have the same pressure that they suffered under to us. They gave us the liberty to go whichever way we want, but their hope is that we succeed. Uh, we have to take accountability, personal accountability with our action. And that's how we're driven into the future tense.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 15:57
You remember how how was it for your parents to adapt and whether it has impacted their mental health at some point?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 16:05
Oh, look, I've seen Mum and Dad broke down many times, but they try to keep face and stay strong, especially when they see us, they are under difficulties. They always have this incredible aura of hope and not hope about themselves, hope about us. They instill hope in us without being direct about it. We did all right. I went to Asia. I grew a business into a huge 6-office business, 128 staff. My brother became one of the most, you know, famous banker there is in Asia. He's a forex trader to begin with, but he's an amazing guy. My sister, uh, works in Saudi, um, for the royal family as a physiotherapist. We all did great stuff because of the, this sense of hope when we were kids that we can do it without that pressure. But I know, um, other, particularly Asian families, the parents put undue pressure on them. I guess every parenting is different.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 17:16
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I guess it's also a strategy to help your kids do it, you know, and I understand the mentality in a way. I guess that there are always extremes, you know, um, but the reality is harsh.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 17:32
In some way, um, the ability to cultivate grits, you know, G-R-I-T-S, among the children makes us a much more solid and, you know, stronger people.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 17:48
And I wonder, because I know that you've had so many, um, works in your life, you know, but one of them that is quite interesting is that you were a food delivery rider at some point, part-time.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 18:02
Ah, yes.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 18:02
You threw yourself a little challenge and I remember that you shared with me that, you know, it's a job that mostly migrants do and you kind of realized how they were treated. Yeah. Can you share a bit of a story of how it was like to work as a food delivery rider?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 18:20
Well, the backstory is that, um, uh, instead of paying a gym to get fit, might as well ride a bike and get paid for it, right? And, and then I do enjoy the interactions, the connectivity with the restaurants and the, uh, and the customers. Um, but mostly I, I enjoy the comradeship of fellow bike riders, uh, that delivers food. But as I get stuck into this gig economy, I, I discovered that, I, I know it's better situation now, but in the early days they were exploited big time by the big food platform. They were being taken advantage. There's an imbalance of power. When there's social injustice, I just can't help myself. I just gotta get sucked into it. So I started advocating for, on their behalf because Most of the food delivery riders are actually migrants or international students. ESL, English as a Second Language. So they don't appreciate local law and they don't understand local societal expectations and all that stuff. So they break the law without thinking. And most of it is just due to ignorance. And the problem is that as time progressed, more and more fatalities out on the road. We have 11 deaths so far since the pandemic among food delivery riders, 7 of them in Sydney so far. Yeah, it's horrendous to think, and it's not just the fatality, the death, it's the amount of the injuries, the road accident, and they don't get compensation insurance. It's just because they are treated as independent contractor, which is okay. I'm okay with that. Imbalance of power gets me, so I had to get in there and become very active, and advocacy is my game here. It's not just the Futaliwi platform, it's that the law is wrong. The worst of the worst is the racism meted against the Futaliwi rights because they're foreigners. They don't know how to deal with when they get subjected to racism.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 20:22
And so what is the kind of advice that you give to them?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 20:26
Well, I just said to them, look, um, just play it safe. Walk away if you can, but if not, compliment them. You'd be surprised. You know, when they start abusing you, you have to say something nice to them and they don't know what hit them. And I learned that at school. When I compliment people when they're giving me a hard time, this is useless. It's not working. I better go away and try someone else. And so, yeah, little things like that. Because the worst thing can happen is that some of them can get a bit aggro. And make things worse. So diplomacy is the best approach as far as I'm concerned.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 21:03
I like that you said aggro. It's such an Australian term, you know, it took me a while to get the slang aggro for those who don't know it is aggressive in Australian.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 21:14
It's true. I can tell you a good story. Um, I was like in my early 30s, I walk into this country pub. In Kandandra, it's called, uh, Central New South Wales, because I was helping a friend who owns a sunflower farm. So it's harvest time, so all hands on deck. And after harvest time, we went to this pub. As we walk in the door, they look at me and I can see the aggressiveness, the aggro in the men. It's mainly men there. So we went to the bar and my friend Kevin says, you know, um, G'day mate, how you going? Like that, right? And he said, the bartender said, more of the usual, Kev? Yeah, mate. What about your mate over there? What does he want? And I, and I look at him square in the eye. I said, I'll have a midi, thank you. Just like that, you know, something like that. And he says, you an Aussie too? I said, true blue. And then everyone broke out laughing, you know, they thought I was like, like a Japanese, uh, wanting to buy out their farm. You know, this is the, the racism. That's happening there. But you know, most of these people are country bumpkins, they're just ignorant about the real world. This is one of the things that I try to encourage everyone when they finish school, have a gap year, go out there, backpack around the world and see other cultures. You will experience conflict. You will experience famine, if not for yourself, and you will experience poverty. Then you come back. A better person and you'll be able to appreciate and connect with those who are less fortunate than you are.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 22:53
Totally. I agree. I reflected on this recently because when I was living in France, I had no idea what it was like to be a migrant, to be, to be honest, you know, and now that I've had this experience, I realize what they were probably going through and I had no idea at the time. And I wish I had known because I could have been a bit more helpful, you know, I regret that. People who were studying at the same university, they had French as a second language and, you know, I should have come to them and say, hey, are you okay? Do you need some help? Probably was too self-absorbed at the time to even do that. I guess it's hard to imagine what life may be like for them when you have never been in this position yourself.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 23:36
Yeah, this is it. Empathy is literally putting yourself in the shoes, you know, wearing the same shoes as the other person. And the only way you can practice empathy is like method acting, you know, you be like them or be exposed, uh, go, go to where they are, hang out with these people, and then you'll understand what it's like.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 23:54
Yeah, it makes you a better person. But to come back to what you were saying, I like the way you used slang and language to make yourself a bit more included. And I think that's a great strategy. I think that when you can have that attitude, people probably connect with you more, and it's probably been very useful to be able to do that, right? In many contexts, I'm assuming.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 24:16
Uh, how true. Uh, in the greater context, you know, even in global con— context, you know, there's so much conflict in our world here. Why can't we get along? And part of it's because of Fear. Fear of the unknown, the other people, the other culture. Fear of this, fear of that. And those who are fearmongers, you know, those who impose fear on us, whatever it is, be it climate change, be it foreigners from another country, Pakistani or Indian, whatever, right? We have a great country here and I'm so grateful, except me and provide me all these opportunities. That's why I feel indebted to Australia, like big time, you know, and I want to do my bit, whether it's in my neighborhood, you know, I take old people for walks so they don't feel lonely, or even for the greater nation, contributing to the economy my own little way by running business or helping others for that matter. I think we all have to do that.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 25:24
Yeah, to give back in a way, uh, or another. Um, there is something as well that I wanted to explore with you is the way you perceive your identity because you combine Chinese ancestry with a childhood spent in Indonesia and you've lived many years in Australia now. So I wonder whether you have to negotiate between multiple, perhaps conflicting identities in your life?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 25:52
Mm. That's a good question. Uh, the way how I look at it is not only just being open-minded about everything, anything new, but to be able to distinguish what is good and what is bad. Reject what is bad, accept what is good, notwithstanding whether it's from the Chinese culture or from the Australian you know, go up and get going kind of grit attitude. Just take the best of the best. And if it's bad, throw away. And that is why what propelled me into the future. I never ever go backward. I never do what I did before. I was once an engineer, no longer. I just keep moving forward. You only live once, max it. Do different stuff altogether. So that's why I move forward, do something different, change.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 26:45
And I guess changing countries and changing roles in life, there is a bit of a connection here. It's the capacity to reinvent yourself, you know?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 26:55
Yes, but it requires one key quality, and that is the ability to embrace change. And overcome the fear there will be.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 27:08
Yeah, it's a big one. It's a big one. And it's, it's tough, right? To embrace change. But you get more comfortable with getting uncomfortable, I think at some point.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 27:19
Yes. Yes. I mean, look, I was in engineering and mining, then I ended up in, uh, marketing. Uh, I was sent to Japan to sell the, the coking coal to the Japanese steel mills. Then I was in manufacturing, building products. It's baby steps that allied to the previous role that I had, eventually becoming a sustainable building, green building designer certifier. You know, like, how different is that to being a coal miner?
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 27:47
It's amazing. It would probably make you grow so much to be confronted to so many different contexts because you are with very different type of people in a different mindset, in a different system.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 28:01
Yep, I can say that. With my hands on my heart, I had a really, really wonderful life so far. Yeah. And I encourage all those who are watching us here to just, uh, be bold, be brave, have hope in your heart. Just go forth and do something different.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 28:20
Yeah. And on the topic, I wonder whether there is something that has helped you in your life to feel included in Australia, to feel valued, to give meaning to your life that perhaps you could give to others as an advice? What would it be if you had a word of wisdom or an advice to give that helped you in your life? Wow.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 28:41
You know what's missing these days is the respect for the elderlies, the senior citizens. And I would say, listen for the voice of wisdom coming out of your father and mother, your grandfather, granddad. Your uncles. They have so much to give to you. And ignore them at your own peril. Because this world is a cruel world. You get left behind and you have to survive like most of us did. And I say that truly because one of the things I do is preventing suicide among the male population. It's a horrendous statistics there.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 29:28
What is the statistic? Do you have it?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 29:30
Yes. Well, every single day, 8 Australians take their own lives, but not 1 or 2 or 3, 6 out of 8 are males, mainly men and fathers. It's horrendous. And we are our own bloody fault as men. We don't talk about it and we keep killing ourselves. And it's been going on forever. And there's not enough resources, not enough programs, not enough funding. That is one of my other advocacies that I'm working on. Yeah, I don't want to get too sentimental here because it's really quite emotional when I come across monthly, easily in my frontline advocacy, you know, I get 2 to 3 men dead, literally. So I, I, in some way I become very numb to it. Um, but the another dimension, I, it spurs me on, particularly in the political arena. If, if I can help out to convince the politicians or even become one myself, right? Um, to stop this carnage. It really is. I mean, it's scary.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 30:40
I wonder what is the statistics of Australia in comparison to other countries, whether in Australia it's higher than other countries? Do you know that?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 30:47
Well, this is it, uh, in the Western world, it's the same old stories. They're not doing enough about suicide prevention among the male population. Um, but it's better than nothing because in third world countries, they don't have the infrastructure or the resources to do anything about it. So they just ignore it. It relies on family, clanship, that kind of stuff. Uh, but here we can, it's just that our priority is not Not there yet. It's okay. I'm working on it.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 31:16
You're working on it. Well, we believe in you, Steve, right? You have to change the situation. I have two weird questions that I usually ask my guests, and the first one is, what does the word migrant mean to you?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 31:35
It's hope. H-O-P-E. Hope. Hope for the nation, for Australia.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 31:41
Hope for the nation.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 31:42
Hope for the community. Hope for the family, the new generations, second and third generation, fourth even. You can see the children of the First Fleet, most of them are doing well right now. So will be the migrants. But the difference is that the migrants will bring in a different dimension. It's a cultural dimension. They will bring in all the good stuff from their culture, and if they're smart, they will reject all the bad stuff that's going on. Hope. Emma, hope. That's what migrant equate to.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 32:19
Yeah.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 32:20
Wow.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 32:20
I like that. That's very inspirational. And so the second question is, what does being Australian mean to you?
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 32:30
That's a hard one because there's multifactorial there. Gratefulness. Yeah. Um, to me, we are in a very amazing, unique circumstance where we can advance Australia our own way. Again, hope. And so for me being an Australian, I'm part of that. I'm maybe just one citizen. You know, nobody important, right? But my contribution to society here will be like a spearhead to what will become good stuff for, for the rest of Australia.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 33:08
So in a way, in one word, it would be opportunity.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 33:12
Wow. Um, yes. Uh, thanksgiving, you know, I'm thankful for the opportunities. If I was still stuck in Indonesia to this very day, I wouldn't have the opportunity. There's the opportunities that have been given to me, literally. Um, I had to stick them out. It's not on a silver plate, but nevertheless, there's opportunities here. Yeah. I believe you can be legally and technically called a migrant too. So you, you, you will emphasize with, with me, you know, what I said. Yeah.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 33:45
I definitely am. I have the privilege of looking like I'm Australian. You know, people don't question where I'm from based on how I look. But as soon as I open my mouth, they know, you know, that as, as soon as I open my mouth, they, they ask the question.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 34:00
My goodness. That to me is, is a good thing. Never lose your accent. It's an advantage to have an accent.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 34:08
It's funny that you say that because for so many years I really felt disempowered by it. I really felt ashamed of having an accent because I, Yeah, because I felt that people treated me differently, that people expected less of me professionally speaking most of the time. And so, yeah, I think I was a bit against it and only recently I've changed my mindset around it and I'm starting to embrace it a bit more and think of it as a richness rather than, um, something that prevents me from getting the life I want.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 34:46
In life, you have to differentiate yourself. My pair of white glasses, for example, and accent is one of it. And it, to me, it's a distinct advantage. You will have enemies. I think I said this to you before. I have enemies, lots of enemies, but that's because I did stuff. And if I didn't do any of this advocacy, for example, I wouldn't have enemies. And what's life is without enemies?
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 35:10
Yeah, if you don't have enemies, maybe you're not doing enough, you know, maybe you're not living the life you're meant to be living in a way.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 35:17
Yeah, there you go.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 35:19
Well, Steve, it was so great to have you share your story in such an open and transparent way. So thank you for that.
Steve Khouw (Guest) · 35:28
My pleasure.
Emma Bellamy-Dodd (Host) · 35:31
Thank you for listening to this episode. I hope you enjoyed it. My conversation with Steve and the story he has shared. If you did, please like, follow, and rate the show. That would make a massive, massive difference to the podcast. Next week, I will be interviewing Ioana Jury, another immigrant who left her country with the dream of building a better life for herself in this country. I was your host, Emma Bellamy, and I cannot wait to bring you on another journey from there to here.
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