Is this a true story?

Yes. Paul Tredinnick is a real person who shared their own story in their own words. Kintsugi Heroes is a not-for-profit that shares first-person stories of overcoming adversity, told with the person's consent.

What organisation produced this?

Kintsugi Heroes, a registered Australian not-for-profit. Every story is shared with the hero's own consent and reviewed under Kintsugi Heroes' trauma-informed content standard before it goes public.

What did Paul Tredinnick learn from this experience?

Paul's parents showed him that the point of working hard is to give your children opportunities to experience life, not to achieve status or wealth.

What would Paul Tredinnick want listeners to know?

The small acts of kindness Paul remembers from his childhood hospital stays, a nurse watching football with him, a teacher coming in for lessons, shaped him far more than the medical interventions.

What helped Paul Tredinnick most along the way?

Paul built his career on being kind and growing businesses for their own sake, not on climbing the ladder, and he never wanted to be a different person at work than he was at home.

What would Paul Tredinnick tell someone going through something similar?

When Paul was told he might only have five years to live, the only way he survived that darkness was by forcing himself to stay in life rather than retreat, and by leaning on friends, family, and faith.

What topics does this episode cover?

This conversation includes welcome to kintsugi heroes, a career that looked like success from the outside, the accounting cadetship that lasted five weeks, learning to speak like a teacher in the boardroom, the childhood illness that taught him about sacrifice and moving to ballarat for the experience, not the job title.

Terminated Employment & Challenging Surgeries after Cancer Diagnosis with Paul Tredinnick

Kintsugi Studio

Terminated Employment & Challenging Surgeries after Cancer Diagnosis with Paul Tredinnick | Kintsugi Heroes Stories

Overview

Three days after walking his daughter down the aisle, Paul Tredinnick received two pieces of news that would reshape his life. His doctor called about elevated prostate cancer markers. A week later, his employer terminated his role immediately after he disclosed the diagnosis. Within months, he learned his cancer had a Gleason score of 9 out of 10, indicating aggressive growth. He faced the darkest moment when doctors suggested he might have five years to live. Then the PET scan showed the cancer was contained, and surgery became possible.

What pulled Paul through was not denial, though his mind tried that at first. It was a deliberate choice to stay in life when everything in him wanted to withdraw. He forced himself to keep training, to show up for dinners he didn't want to attend, to lean on his wife, his children, his faith, and his closest friends. He had robotic prostate surgery while simultaneously selling the family home. He moved to the Northern Beaches with his wife, a dream deferred that suddenly felt urgent. He began a new job, hopeful and still healing.

But what shaped Paul most was not the surgery or the diagnosis itself. It was remembering what had shaped him as a child: the small acts of kindness he could never forget. A nurse who sat with him during a rugby league match. A teacher who came in for lessons. Moments of time given freely. Now, recovering and rebuilding, Paul is channelling that understanding into Acts of Kindness, a movement focused on tiny gestures done with care for others. He knows that small things, done with intention, can shift how people treat each other.

Chapters

0:00
Welcome to Kintsugi Heroes
Introduction to the podcast and content warning.
2:29
A career that looked like success from the outside
Paul describes his professional rise from accounting to marketing leadership, shaped by a traditional Australian family.
6:56
The accounting cadetship that lasted five weeks
Paul talks about abandoning insolvency work to pursue teaching, then pivoting to marketing at Unilever.
11:01
Learning to speak like a teacher in the boardroom
Paul reflects on how his education background shaped his approach to marketing and communication.
14:46
The childhood illness that taught him about sacrifice
Paul recalls spending his early years in and out of hospital, watching his parents' selfless care.
21:48
Moving to Ballarat for the experience, not the job title
Paul explains the decision to relocate his family to regional Victoria to give his children different opportunities.
25:22
Being told he was too nice for corporate success
Paul describes performance reviews that criticized his kindness as a weakness despite delivering growth.
36:06
A wedding, then a call about PSA levels
Paul's daughter gets married on a Saturday; three days later his doctor rings about elevated prostate cancer markers.
40:33
Terminated, one week after the cancer diagnosis begins
Paul's employer terminates his role immediately after he discloses a possible prostate cancer diagnosis.
47:18
The MRI shows something, the biopsy confirms it
Paul receives his prostate cancer diagnosis with a Gleason score of 9 out of 10, indicating aggressive growth.
53:53
Told he might have five years, then learning the cancer is contained
Paul experiences the darkest moment when given a poor prognosis, then relief when the PET scan shows no spread.
1:05:19
Surgery, recovery, and selling the family home
Paul undergoes robotic prostatectomy and begins the process of moving to the Northern Beaches with his wife.
1:12:25
A year of highs and lows, and what comes next
Paul reflects on twelve months of wedding, cancer, job loss, and recovery, and speaks about his vision for Acts of Kindness.

1 of 7

A career that looked like success from the outside

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 02:29

Thanks, John. Yeah, it's wonderful to be here. I come here with a feeling of, which others might say, imposter syndrome. You know, people often talk about what I've done professionally and whatnot. And I go, yeah, yeah, but isn't that what everyone does kind of thing? But Mate, it's a pleasure to be here and certainly great to share a bit of my journey because it's definitely not all highs.

John Milham (Host) · 02:56

And from a podcasting, from a Ghoulish podcasting host point of view, I'm so glad it's not all highs, right? Because—

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 03:04

Yeah, true. That's boring.

John Milham (Host) · 03:06

Yeah. No, not at all. And it's interesting you say that. Imposter syndrome is such a secondary theme for this series of podcasts. So many people we talk to with amazing stories feel like they've just done what they needed to do. But the everyday hero is this, um, is a Kintsugi hero.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 03:28

That's been interesting. You talk about imposter syndrome because it's been a particularly, and we'll get into my story, particularly the last 12 months of my story. And I've had so many, I guess I was just living life and I never reflected. The last 12 months has been a huge time of reflection. And that's where you start going into this imposter syndrome going, I'm not meant to be here. That's, yeah, you're talking about other people. Other people have done these amazing things or other people have been on these, you know, really rough journeys. No, that's not me. So you start sharing your story and you realize, no, maybe there is something there to share with others.

John Milham (Host) · 04:06

I'd love to start the process by, Paul, how did you form? What's your background, mate? And, um, Where did you do that?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 04:14

Yeah, my, my background, yeah, is very traditional. Born, born in, born in Melbourne. So apologies for that, but that's okay. Born, born in Melbourne, lived there to the grand age of about 18 months, but still a proud, proud Melbournian. Family of 4 kids in, in our family. I was the only one born in Melbourne. My parents were down there working at the, at the time, and then we came back up to Sydney. Yeah, my amazing family, as I say, one, one of 4 kids. Older sister, older brother, myself, and then a younger brother, much younger brother, 7 years younger than me. So dad's a PK, preacher's kid. So worked in the bank all his life, I think left school at 14 and whatnot and did all those things. So, and mum was a nurse. So I think we were just that very quintessential Aussie family, 4 kids, mum and dad both working and they worked through my entire life, which was awesome. Mum, as I say, being a nurse, She worked phenomenal hours to keep us and give us an amazing life with education and everything we need and great trips and everything else. But again, I even look at that and I go, oh, we lived a phenomenal life. We did these incredible— oh, what'd you do? Oh, we'd pack up our tents and we'd go in the car and we'd do 2-week road trips up to the Barrier Reef and back again. It's like, and to me, that was the most amazing thing. We'd all set up tents or as we're going up, we'd sleep in the back of the car and the most amazing trips in the world. And now I think back on, yeah, okay, probably they weren't as amazing as other people's trips, but in our world, that was absolutely special. So that's very traditional background. Yeah. Fun schooling and everything else. Finished school and I guess like many people of my era, I don't know whether I give away my age, but my area was told, yeah, go and do an accounting cadetship. So I thought, yeah, I'll go and do an accounting cadetship. I lasted, I think maybe 5 weeks in accounting cadetship. I was working in insolvency and insolvency to me, and I apologize to anyone listening that's in insolvency. I felt like a tow truck driver. I was waiting for the crash to happen so I could walk in and make money for this accounting firm. And I went into some horrendous businesses. And one guy, I remember he was sitting in his wheelchair and he tried to create this business and I walked in, I said, g'day mate, how are you? And he goes, well, how would you feel if you're sitting in a wheelchair and your whole company's just gone bust? I went, wow, that hurt. So that was my accounting experience.

The accounting cadetship that lasted five weeks

John Milham (Host) · 06:56

I finished— That sounds like, you know, I tried accounting, similar kind of profile, wasn't for me. I remember sitting there, had a view over to Northern Suburbs Crematorium from the uni. And as I was looking down, realizing my trial balance would never balance, I thought that was a bit of a— there was a puff of smoke as my accounting aspirations went up with whoever was actually, you know, being farewell at the time.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 07:23

So, so similar. I ended up stopping that literally after 5 weeks. I had also applied for a course. This sounds extremely the other side. To do primary school teaching. So I went off to uni, packed up accounting, 3 weeks later I was sitting in uni doing a Bachelor of Education in primary teaching. So show, we talk about, you know, I talk about the contrast or the contrast of life's journey. My whole life, last 12 months have been massive contrast, but I guess my journey has been contrast and experiencing those contrasts. So yeah, 3 years I came out as a qualified, yeah, Bachelor of Education primary school teacher, which was cool. I was ready to teach, love teaching, absolutely love teaching. You finish uni, you have stupidly 3 months before you can actually start teaching. Over that time, I'm like, okay, I want to get in and do something. Open a newspaper. For those people that don't remember, newspapers were these things that we used to read in cafes and whatnot. So looking at a newspaper, there was a job there for a graduate trainee at marketing graduate traineeships at Unilever. So I went, well, that just sounds interesting. Still always thought I'd teach, but applied for the job, wrote them a letter. They had things and we used to put stamps on them anyway. So wrote them a letter, got a reply back saying, yeah, we'd love to see you. And I thought, yeah, I'll go through this because I'm really interested in what those people do. Probably 8 interviews back and forward. I had a great time. I had a great time asking them a lot of questions because I was more interested. I never thought I was going to do a graduate traineeship at Unilever. I just thought I was going to teach. So I went to these interview panels of people and they'd be asking me a bit about me and what I'm like as a person and whatnot, and I'd chat to them about what they're like. Still never thought. The day before school was about to start and I'd gone out and I was hoping to pick up casual teaching roles the day before. School started, got a call from Unilever to say, hey, we'd like you on our marketing graduate program. Would you like to join us? So I never, never taught primary school, officially never taught primary school and became a marketing graduate at Unilever. Joined there with business students. One of my best mates there, he was a zoologist. It was his degree. And we all joined as marketing grads at Unilever and it was awesome. Absolutely awesome. And always, I mean, most obviously 80%, 90% of people I, I have then worked with are business grads. But I tell you, it was interesting. And Unilever, by the way, is a phenomenon. It's like a university. They teach you the Unilever way. And I was hungry to learn because I had done education. So I just wanted to learn. So I went to every single possible course. That Unilever would throw at me, lunchtime courses and everything, because I was getting paid to learn the Unilever way of marketing. I mean, how good's this? So it was fantastic. What I also found though in having a teaching background is as a marketer and particularly in business, you're often talking to a group of people that have their own interests at heart that really you've got to get their attention, probably worse than primary school kids. So you learn very quickly how to talk to them in a simple way. This is what we're gonna go through today. This is what I want you to get out of it. Let me start here. That's the way I would start a teaching lesson. That's the same way I would start a presentation on this new product that I'm about to launch. And I haven't changed my style in that.

Learning to speak like a teacher in the boardroom

John Milham (Host) · 11:01

Well, no judgment about how you see us all as nothing but primary school kids, but—

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 11:08

Particularly boardrooms, particularly boardrooms.

John Milham (Host) · 11:10

Well, yeah, now I can see that.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 11:12

Absolutely. Yeah.

John Milham (Host) · 11:13

Yeah. Now, so it's interesting. There you are, a fresh graduate. With a new career you're not even aware you're in yet, right? And you've had, like, as you describe your parents, they sound wonderful. So such an Australian kind of setup for that time, you know, the family car and holidays and, you know, dad's a banker and mum's a nurse, like the nature of our society. What do you think was most important about, you know, that process as you were transitioning out of that childhood and into your own world? What What did you take?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 11:47

Yeah, I think the things that I took from that is, and I don't want to say work hard because that's so cliché, but what they did for me was give me opportunities. So yes, they worked hard and mum would do night duty so that she could work at night so she was at home with us during the day and stuff like that. So they worked hard, but it wasn't to be successful. Success for them was giving their family opportunities. And that's the big thing I think I have taken away. My motivation every day in everything I've done was to give my kids and my family opportunities to have a good life. And that's been absolutely my— so they've given a lot to me. My motivation is to give, I guess, selfishly to my family, to just give them opportunities to, again, not be, you know, have the biggest house or any of that, but just to have opportunities to experience life has been my motivation. And that's been our driving force for my wife and I through all that, because I feel not that they sacrificed, but that was certainly my parents. And then we had challenging times and we, we talk about the peaks and valleys. I was a very sick child, so I had a massive, massive blockage in one of my kidneys. So I was my first probably 5 years of life. I spent as much time in the hospital as outta hospital. Now again, what I remember of that time is I can't remember much of what I was going through. Obviously you, you, you're young, but what I do remember again is the sacrifice of my parents. And so what have I taken? And what do I mean by that? So my dad, there's myself and then there's 3 other kids at home. My dad would go to work in the morning. My mum would get the kids ready to school. My mum would be at the hospital with me all day. She would then race home in the afternoon. My dad wouldn't go home straight after work, would come to the hospital till visiting hour. In those days, you had to leave at visiting time. He would be at hospital till 8 o'clock at night. Tilly could go home, see the kids briefly before they all went to bed and we'd repeat this and we repeated this for months and years. So what do I remember? Yeah, it's the sacrifice and now I'm going to get upset. And what I remember my dad saying is the hardest thing for him was hearing his child crying saying, don't leave me. It's that's the, what did I get out of my younger years? It's that sacrifice of my parents where they gave up so much. For their, for their kids and for their family. And that's, that's my driving motivation in my life.

John Milham (Host) · 14:38

Wow. You know, the, the idea, you know, you say you don't remember being ill. How do you think it's shaped you? Yeah.

The childhood illness that taught him about sacrifice

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 14:46

And I've only started to realize this over what I've been through in the last 12 months. Uh, I've started to reflect back on why I am who I am and, and how that shaped me. Um, and I'd forgotten, and, and I'd probably even forgotten how much of an impact that has, that has had on me. But that, um, absolute selfless acts is, is how it shaped me. And if there's glimpses of memories through a time of being, you know, quite, quite ill and lots and lots and lots of operations and whatnot. Yeah. And, and they're only vague glimpses of memories, but that nurse that wasn't just there to change leads or do anything like that, but would sit on the bed. And back in those days, I think we had the MCO Cup was the rug rugby league was on a Wednesday night. Again, showing my age. And a nurse that would sit there and watch the football with me for 10 minutes. They're the memories I have. So all the bad memories, I think our minds, yeah, let them go. The memories I have of people just doing those little things. I had a a teacher that would come in because I was missing a lot of school and would just do lessons with me. They're the memories I have. So just those little 10-minute acts of just giving someone a little bit of time, I think, is the thing that I'm realizing more and more have molded the way I like to think is just give someone, anyone, just that little bit of time. Now, Yeah, from my parents, it's absolutely about giving as many opportunities as you can for your kids and sacrificing for your kids. But on a broader scale, the things that I remember even through challenging times is that person that didn't save my life or didn't do the major surgery, but it was the person that just gave me 10 minutes to say, "Oh, tell me about the game. Who's playing?" kind of thing, just gave me a little bit of their time. And I think, and I didn't realize how much maybe that has shaped me and how I think in my life.

John Milham (Host) · 16:48

So the idea here, you are a very fresh and enthusiastic young graduate, right? About to dive into the exciting world of corporate marketing without spending a lot of time in every business decision. What do you take out of all of that? Because you had a long and interesting career in that space.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 17:12

Yeah, and I think that's it. It's been interesting. I've moved from You know, Unilever. I spent a bit of time in those days at Fuji Films. So yeah, cameras and whatnot. Yeah, exactly.

John Milham (Host) · 17:25

Jumping from sunset industry to sunset industry.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 17:28

Exactly. So that was, you know, and then ended up at a company called Monsanto. It's a life sciences business looking after their lawn and garden products. I was head of sales and marketing there for a number of years. And that was great. It wasn't until an opportunity, by this stage I was married, had a couple of young kids and a recruiter rings me up going, Hey, would you be interested in a role, group marketing manager of Mars? I went, yeah, tell me a bit about it. Mars Confectionery, looking after chocolates. I'm like, oh, this is fantastic. I've been in lawn and garden products now. You want me to look after chocolates? So he is going to me, yeah, I said, yeah, whereabouts are they based? He goes, oh, in Ballarat in Victoria. I went, you gotta be kidding. I'm not moving from Sydney to Ballarat. Thank you very much, but no. Anyway, he rings back a couple more times and he says, And which I really love, he said, don't look at the role. I want you to just meet a particular person. I want you to meet the head of marketing down there, a guy called William Saxon, beautiful person, actually lives up here on the Northern Beaches, still very good friends with him and just have a coffee with him, just have a coffee and a chat. And I think the reason I talk about that is it probably sums up what's important to me. Yes, I could have looked at the role and this is how much you're going to earn, blah, blah, blah. So not important. What I wanted to know about is the person that I'll be working with. And that's probably sums up my moves in my career and where it's worked and hasn't worked. So anyway, I had a coffee with William as a lovely, very caring person, incredibly smart businessman, but incredibly caring, ridiculously caring person as well. So he said, come down to Ballarat and see what you think. So my wife and I flew down and and had a look and went out to dinner and that with him and his wife over a weekend and that. Still, I get on the plane and go, "That was amazing. What amazing people. Anyway, let's get on with our life." And what my wife says to me going, "So when are we going?" I'm like, "What? You actually want to do this?" So we packed up our family and moved to Ballarat. So why did we do that? And you look at it as a great career opportunity, no doubt. What we realized, and again, this talks a bit about me, It was a great experience for our kids. We were able to live in regional Australia in Ballarat, which is just an absolutely stunning town. Still pursue my career in it with tremendous career opportunity, but give the chance, just the chance for our kids to just experience different things. So they found a great school there. They would go to their kids' place, friends, school friends in the afternoon and we'd pick them up. 20 minutes down the road, but 20 minutes in Ballarat, you go a long way in 20 minutes in Ballarat. And there's my daughter riding up there, running up the road on horseback, you know, to meet me as I drive into these people's car park and whatnot. And it was nothing fancy. They lived on a little farm and these people were just salt of the earth people. Amazing, amazing experiences. And I guess that's the stuff that my parents gave me. So why did we do things like that. Absolute fantastic career move. But the motivation was giving ourselves and our kids just amazing experiences. And we loved it. I was in Ballarat. So what are you doing in Ballarat? My kids wanted to learn to ride horses, so they went to horse riding lessons. And I said to their teacher one day, do you teach adults? She goes, yeah, absolutely. I said, would you teach me? She said, yeah. Can you do Saturday afternoons? I went, yeah. So I started this amazing job, group marketing manager at Mars, On a Saturday afternoon, I went to horse riding lessons. It was absolutely, absolutely fantastic. And at the time, look, I enjoyed being fit and I was training for triathlons and all this other stuff. But the thing I love most, and that I'd talk about on Monday at work, was how I went to horse riding lessons and how the horse nearly tipped me off and how I almost landed on the ground and all those things. It's about experiences. So again, Yes, my career's been amazing, but it really has been about giving, giving certainly my family great experiences and prioritizing family. We ended up moving back to Sydney because I wanted to get the kids back to their family, back to my parents, so therefore their grandparents. So that was important to come back to Sydney. So we only spent 2.5, 3 years down there, but a wonderful time. That's how it is.

Moving to Ballarat for the experience, not the job title

John Milham (Host) · 21:48

Enough to pick up your You know, you're, you know, you're specialty in the, what, the barrel race?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 21:55

Exactly, exactly. They never chased me. This person that my teacher was, a judge, an Olympic-level judge, she never said, hey, you should be trying out for the Olympics at this stage. I never quite got there. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Well, you're wasting your time doing all this marketing stuff when you could be in equestrian. But, um, no, definitely not. I was a really bad horse rider.

John Milham (Host) · 22:17

So that, that And not to summarize a long and distinguished business career, but I'm interested to see what do you now know about that, right? So you were in business, you're actually transitioned out of it now and we'll get into that in a minute, but the old, what do you now know? Because you're a very enthusiastic marketer for your own marketing career, right? I love, it sounds very exciting. The whole corporate experience, what do you take out of that?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 22:48

I mean, sadly, I'll say it can be rough. It can be rough. I have a vision. I love growing things and therefore I love growing a business. My passion in marketing is about growing a business. I think marketing is fascinating when you dig into the neuroscience and us marketers have to put catchy words that we talk about neuromarketing and how We're developing brands that come to mind. We call it jargon brand saliency. So a brand that comes to mind at the point of purchase and how we can trigger that for your particular brand to come to mind. So I love the activity of marketing. I love the science behind marketing. Why do I love it? Because I love trying to grow a business. When I walk into a business, my focus there is how can I make a difference? People say to me, tell us a bit about you and your brand. I like to make a difference. Now I say that when I go into a business and I go into a company, I want to make a difference. I don't want to just keep doing the same old, same old. I don't want to caretake anything. I get bored terribly quickly, which is bad. I get bored. I need to be making a difference. I want to make a step change in what we do and I like to push the envelope. So I love marketing, love growing businesses. What I find challenging in business is the Yeah, the negative people that will try and tread on someone else to climb the ladder and all that ladder climbing. I'm so not into it. I'm obviously really, really bad at it, but I'm so, so not into it and don't want to be into it. But I see many people in there just trying to tread on someone else to climb the ladder, put someone else down. It's like, that's what I guess disappoints me in business when they forget about growing the business and are more focused on who can I step on to climb the next step in the ladder for me, that just doesn't interest me. I've been entrepreneurial. I've created business myself and everything. So I've done a lot in business, but my motivation every time is growing, is how can we grow? How can we grow this business? Not how can I get to the next level in this business? And that's probably, people have said, oh, that's not good. You gotta have a hunger for the next level. I have a hunger for making a difference. And then I'll say, look what I've achieved. Do you think I'm worthy of that next level?

John Milham (Host) · 25:10

I like the idea of growing and having that focus, which leads me to the thought of values, right? So what would you say your highest values are?

Being told he was too nice for corporate success

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 25:22

Certainly trying to give to others is my big value. And that's in every And we'll go into the end of where that's taken me. But, you know, I talk about just being kind to others, being thoughtful to others. Now, again, in business is tough. There's some brutal people you come up against. My focus on them always is I am going to smother you in kindness and help you achieve what you need to achieve. I don't care what kind of a person you are, if you're, you know, going you're an aggressive person there, that's your choice and I'm not going to change that. And that's not my job to change that. My job is to actually be kind, be, yeah, I'm going to say it, be kind to others. So my key value I bring in an organization is, yeah, I'm going to be kind and supportive of other people. That means I'm not going to encourage them down wrong paths, but I'm certainly going to be kind and supportive to help them achieve. And doing those acts of kindness, that'll make a difference. I've been in very, very large, and again, I won't say who, but very large organizations. I've sat there in my review, 6-month review. They go, how do you think you're going, Paul? I said, well, you brought me in, you're in negative growth. Within 6 months, I've changed that. You're in positive growth. You've got record profits, right? Yeah, they're the numbers. How do you think you are going, Paul? I go, well, that's what you brought me in for. The numbers are good. Forget about the numbers, Paul. How do you think you're going? I said, well, Based on what I was here to achieve, I think I'm going well. Let me give you some feedback, Paul. Okay. And they go, there's concern by some in the business. You are too nice. It's a true story. And I said, okay. I said, normally I would say that's a real compliment. Thanks very much. Clearly the way you're saying it, it's not a compliment. No. I said, okay, what would you like me to do about that? Because I'm thinking, okay, I'll bait him here. What do you want me to do? Well, I'm not going to tell you what to do. But it troubles people that you are too nice. I thought, okay, so you walk out of that going, how do I take that? Clearly people are feeling uncomfortable because I'm not going to behave the way they behave. I'm going to behave the way— so happy with the results. I'm getting the growth, tickly, tickly, all those, but yeah, yeah, you're getting those, but you, you're being too nice. Two reviews I got told I'm being too nice and that makes people uncomfortable. I thought, okay, If that's the worst legacy I leave in a business is I've given them growth and I've been too nice, then I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. Probably not the place I'm meant to be working, but I'm okay with that. So I've probably taken that with me saying, would I do things differently to how I did things there to last longer? No. If I've left them with a legacy of growth and being too nice, and that was my only review, my only review was ever. You're being too nice. Yeah, people are concerned you're too nice. But I said, but you're happy with the growth of it. Yeah, yeah. Your numbers are great, but you're too nice. I thought, okay, I'll take that. I'll take that. So if I can walk away with that legacy from every place I've been in, I'll go, yeah, that's a successful career.

John Milham (Host) · 28:31

Is it like, so you want to grow and of course marketing is about, you know, sort of connecting with and building relationships that so that people will trust you and take your product, right? So, you know, brand. And so you're bringing that value to be kind and to give to others into a marketing sense. And the corporate world is saying, that's not, you know, we don't like that too much sometimes, right? So how would you then rate it, right? You feel like it sounded, I was picking up that you were actually, you know, feeling like you were you know, you had to justify that. But that's being a good human being, isn't it?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 29:09

Absolutely. No, they were wanting me to change. They were wanting me to behave a little bit more like them, which, which, and I did not. Yeah, I, I, I'm the last to judge others because I'm way, way, way from perfect myself. So, well, I never judged them. Um, they, it probably built, yeah, they would like me to behave a little bit closer to them because that would make them feel more comfortable. Yeah. And I run into it a bit, but I'm kind of like, that's okay. I think I've been put on this planet to certainly be, yeah, do well at business. I think that's been an absolute blessing, but maybe do it in a different way where we can actually do it as a team. People have said to me in the past, You've got double-digit growth the last 3 years. Tell us what's the silver bullet? How have you done this? It's like just building a good team. I said, I haven't done anything. I actually, there's no, hey, you should be doing this all around the world. Here's the secret, just building a good team that are really focused on what they're doing. So no, would I change the way I've behaved in coming? Again, I've been in many, many companies where I know what I would need to do to have been CEO of those organizations. Would I like to be the person I needed to be to be that? No, no way. I, because the other part that gets me is I look at people, like I look at myself going, I need to go home to my kids and be the ultimate, as good as I can, example to them. I can't be a different person. I know others can. I can't be a different person at home to what I am in the workplace. So I, the same person you get at home is the same person you get in the workplace. And I just couldn't, I think it'd be hard work being two different people. So, no, I'm okay with how that's— and that's delivered some blows. That means, yeah, at times that's probably made people uncomfortable and they've said, yeah, you're just not the right fit here. And at the time, I think you take it as a hit, afterwards you go, that's probably a compliment. Um, but it's, it's probably a compliment where, you know, powers that be, God has said, hey, yeah, time for you to move on somewhere else. I got another plan for you now. And, and away we go. And my career has been a journey like that. I've done some amazing things where I've sat back going, how the heck am I here? Um, doing, doing this. And that's when I look at my CV going, and I look at it going, yeah, there's just things I've done. Other people, I'm realizing now, look at it going, 'Hey, there's some big names on there. You've done some big roles.' And I kind of go, 'Yeah, but it was just— that's— I didn't do that. I've been put there for a reason.' Then I moved on to the next thing.

John Milham (Host) · 32:00

Speaking of being put there, right, so you're married and you've got a couple of kids, right? You clearly showed us earlier how high you hold your father, right?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 32:14

Yeah.

John Milham (Host) · 32:15

Although, you know, you know, his career mightn't have been as stellar, but clearly, you know, an amazing man, especially, you know, in your eyes. How, what do you know about fathering and, you know, being the head of a family?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 32:30

Yeah, so little, so little.

John Milham (Host) · 32:33

I can join you on that one, right?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 32:37

Yeah, I remember, I remember. So, um, So I had my first child when I was 26, 27, something like that. So I feel as though I was still growing up myself and I, in the area we were about to have a baby. And I remember actually driving to work. I was working for, again, marketing at Sharp Electronics back in those days, you know, really, really cool company. I'm driving there going, I don't know how to be a farmer, you know. Even though I had had this amazing upbringing, but you don't think at that time, you're 26, young, married, about to have the first child. You go, I have no idea what to do. What I, so I guess the learning is you do, you learn from your parents' actions a lot about how they've treated us. And I never consciously went in going, okay, dad did this, I'm going to do similar. Not once. But I think the, it's the where the heart is and then how we behave and how we prioritize things is, is what you learn.

John Milham (Host) · 33:39

Yeah. So like taking a marketing approach, what's the minimum viable product you're offering in terms of fathering?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 33:47

Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, I think it really is that selfless act. And I think, and as I didn't realize it at the time, but absolutely prioritize. I've, as I say, I've stepped on. No, I've intentionally stepped away from big corporate roles to run a small business on my own, which was a passion. But why did I do that? It gave me time with my kids. So during their younger years, I was at pretty much every swimming carnival and sports carnival and everything else while, and that just worked out for me while others would be traveling the world or doing big corporate gigs. I wasn't there. I was at the swimming carnivals and I was doing the parents-teacher, the parent-teacher race and whatnot, because I could. And I feel incredibly blessed, not because of my career. I feel incredibly blessed because I was given the opportunity in my career where I was doing some stuff for myself at the time where I could be at their sports carnival. So what's the marketing tagline for that is just selfless, is putting them first has been an absolute blessing. And look, if I change things now, I might be, I don't know, head of Coca-Cola or something now, but I would not change it in a heartbeat while prioritizing them. And I think getting those priorities right helped me from a career. And it's actually probably kept me passionate. I still have an absolute love of marketing, so I'm not bitter about business or anything else. I actually get in there and I love driving business. I talk to my kids about about growing a business and different brands. And my daughter's playing around with a new brand that we're gonna launch a couple of products under Belong to the Beach. And it's kind of cool and she created this cool logo and everything else and she's got product ideas. And so we chat a lot about business, but it's fun to be able to share that with the kids as well. So share my love of business with them. But absolutely my takeout and my is And it sounds cliché, it is prioritizing, but I think it's that selfless, nah, the family's gotta come first and we make decisions.

John Milham (Host) · 35:54

Not everything's been sunny. So, you know, you get to, you know, you have these, um, you rack up career milestones and ups and downs, of course, with that on the normal travel, but some challenges come along. Tell us about those.

A wedding, then a call about PSA levels

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 36:06

So the challenges came along 12 months ago, almost today. So, uh, let, let me talk, we'll try and summarize the last 12 months. And we say life is like a roller coaster or, or, um, peaks and valleys. My last 12 months have been the highest peaks and the lowest valleys all in 12 months, almost 12 months to the day. I had a beautiful— my daughter got married. My youngest daughter got married. Absolutely incredible wedding. I've got 2 daughters, 28 and 25. So incredible, magnificent wedding, lovely guy and everything else. That was on a Saturday. I had before that had, had got a call from a doctor saying, hey, your PSA level. I didn't even know what a PSA level was. I'd done some blood tests. My doctor threw in all these letters on a, on a form. And anyway, he rings me and he goes, mate, cholesterol, everything's fantastic. You're really healthy. There's one little score I'm concerned about. Um, come and see me. And I went, yeah, yeah, yeah. I got a wedding on the weekend. Yeah, well, I'll come and see. Went and saw him 3 days after, after the wedding. He said, your PSA level. I thought, what is, what is PSA level? He means, ah, look, it's probably nothing to worry about, but Yeah, you know, possible chance of prostate cancer. I'm like, yeah, okay, whatever. That's, that's definitely not me, but let's do the test again. He said, how long since the test? I said, it's been over 6 weeks. So we did, we did the test again thinking that was just an absolute false positive. Did the test again. So we're now literally 5 days or something after our most, most amazing wedding. My daughter's about to go on her honeymoon. I'm dropping them at the airport and whatnot. Um, then got the test, he said, you better come and see me. And instead of my results going back down to normal, it's actually going up higher, fairly rapidly now. I'm still going, yeah, it's nothing to worry about. I said, other things can cause an elevated PSA. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but, but I want to now refer you on to a, a urologist. Um, like, and, um, oh, what is that? Lifehouse. Um, you know, and I want you to go there. I'm like, what are you talking about? You don't know who you're talking to. I don't get cancer. Um, anyway, they, they, so they, they booked me in to see a urologist and start to look at, have I got prostate cancer? I mean, yeah, this isn't happening. We're over work and we're getting ready for our big annual conference and my whole team are having to basically run the conference. So I was very busy at work, focused on that. Arrive at work and my boss says, is everything okay? You've been back at the doctor a couple of times in the last week. I said, oh, they think I might have prostate cancer. I'm sure it's nothing to worry about, but I've now got to go through a number of tests and see a urologist. But anyway, I'll keep you posted. That was the end of the discussion. We're having a coffee. Um, went about conference. Um, one night I came back, very successful conference, sitting with my team. Um, after the conference, this is a week and couple of days after the wedding, get called into an office and trying to think the wording was, the head of HR, and I won't say the company, and my boss is sitting there and they go, we'd like to read this letter. Quite simply, it says that my company, I won't say who, has lost confidence in your ability to perform your role to the required standard., and therefore we are terminating your employment immediately. And I said, what? I said, what are you talking about? And they said, that's all we can give you. We're not allowed to say anything else. I said, but you gave me a performance bonus 4 days ago because the last 12 months I've performed really well. Is that correct? We can't say anything. I said, but all my reviews have been, they do, you know, meets expectation, above expectation. All my reviews have been above expectation. Is that correct? We cannot say anything, Paul. We can only give you this letter. Let's just say they didn't say anything. And so in a week, I had this wedding. You get diagnosed with cancer, which at this stage I'm still saying can't be real. Then your company goes, well, in effect, you told us you might have cancer. We're going to terminate your role here. Um, so yeah, I sat in the car and I'm driving home. My daughter's on a honeymoon and I'm having to ring my wife and say, this is, this has just happened. Very surreal. I, I can't comprehend what was it going through my mind at that stage.

Terminated, one week after the cancer diagnosis begins

John Milham (Host) · 40:33

How did that hit, right? You said surreal. Could you even accept things?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 40:37

No. No. And I think that was, that was it, John. I, I, I think my coping mechanism, I, I didn't accept anything. It was just like, no, this will all go away. I won't have, I definitely haven't got cancer at this stage. I was convinced I didn't have cancer. And from a work point of view, I maybe probably even thought, yeah, that's good. I wasn't really comfortable there. Things had changed there. New opportunities will come. So I was in just this numbness of, no, this is all going to go away and new things will come. At that stage, it really didn't hit. And I think it takes a little while to hit. Work-wise, I went down the path of talking to lawyers and doing all that because everyone goes, you've got to talk to a lawyer, this wrong. And the lawyers told me what I guess they tell everyone, yeah, we can fight it. Who knows what'll happen? This is, they will tie it up in court for many, many years. It will risk you a lot of money. You gotta decide if you want to go down that path or not. So unfortunately, these things happen in business and certainly I find in law, that's what I was given. From multiple lawyers, multiple lawyers. They said to me, have you got a letter from your employer saying we terminated you because you had cancer? I said, well, no, I don't think many companies give those out. Well, unless we've got that, you really haven't got— I said, I've got a letter that says after giving me bonuses and all this, that now we've decided this. They said, nah, it won't really stand up. It's going to be hard. So I went down those paths, got all the, you know, a lot of anger that someone could do that. As the anger was there, I was starting to move into this cancer journey as well. So these things are running parallel where I'm talking to lawyers and Fair Work Commission and Human Rights Commission and all of this stuff saying, what's the real story here? At the same token, this crazy journey of cancer is kind of creeping up on me as well. So now you've booked into the urologist. The urologist goes, yeah, look, PSA test doesn't mean everything. Yeah, let's, let's go on and do an MRI. I'm thinking, but he said, I want to keep moving this reasonably quickly. Let's get you in for MRI. I think I was doing the MRI one day, had meetings at Fair Work Commission or something the next day. It's just like, you gotta be kidding. Fair Work Commission basically said, too hard. You needed to apply and you're 3 days out. I mean, they, they weren't, weren't a ton of help. Almost went, thank goodness, cuz I can't fight that fight at the moment. MRI comes out saying, yeah, you've, um, there's definitely a something there. That's all an MRI says. Yeah, we know now it was a very large tumor, but, but, um, you know, at that stage, that's all an MRI says, that there is something there. So Again, with almost a couple of days, Fair Work go, not much we are going to be able to do to help. Take it to the Human Rights Commission. Um, 2 days later I get an MRI saying, yeah, you got, you got something there. We need to take this further. So I'm like, okay, definitely times, times of anger. Definitely, definitely times of anger. And I'm working even to this day hard to, um, not have that anger cuz I think it's, it's pointless. Um, to the point where I actually work really hard at trying to be forgiving. I think people do things for silly reasons and I don't think they're out to ruin portrait in its life or career. They just did silly things at silly times. So I actually try, I'm not very good at it, but I try and be forgiving on these things.

John Milham (Host) · 44:18

So, um, yeah, it would be, it'd be hard to work out that, uh, yeah, maybe to reframe things, right? So that, you know, the corporation, well, they were just doing the best they could.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 44:30

And it's funny, people, smarter people may kind of say, you are dwelling on it every day and every time you think about it, it hurts you and you get upset and you get angry. They're not, they've moved on. So you're thinking about it all the time. You're not hurting them, you're hurting yourself. So, and that's easy. I get it. Easier said, what was done was horrific. Like was horrific. To do that to someone that's been diagnosed with cancer is almost unimaginable. And a part of me made, which is really weird, feel sorry for them that they could do that to someone. I desperately hope I would never, ever do that, but it's real. And that's one of the learnings out of this is it's real and not as uncommon as what I realized. And I'll get to that. Um, cause it's actually common. It's more common that that discrimination against people with disability we know is common. I admit it, I'm a, I'm a white male in Australia. I hadn't experienced heavy discrimination until I had, in effect, a disability of, of cancer. And wow, wow, it's, it's, it's real.

John Milham (Host) · 45:38

Yeah, you mentioned forgiveness, right? And practicing forgiveness. I think there's a real point in that, right?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 45:43

So did—

John Milham (Host) · 45:44

was this something you needed to add to your world, uh, because of who you were and what your life was like, or is this, you know, that comes out of result of, uh, as a result of that tough time?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 45:56

Well, look, selfishly, I think the forgiveness comes from, I need to, I need to forgive to be able to, it's about me. Selfish, selfishly, forgiveness is often about yourself more, more than them. They're not looking for forgiveness. Um, so they're not saying, you give this to me. It's allowing me to move on with my life in forgiving them. They know not what they do. Another very famous person used that line. And but I believe it. I actually believe it. They believe what they're doing is right. They know not what they do to others and what they did to me. And one day, knowing that I forgave them, will hopefully change their life and they will be blessed in a special way. And I don't mean a blessing in, yeah, get the next step in their career, but they're blessed in really changing them. So, and that's a journey. Forgiveness is not a thing I've just, I've decided to do this. No, no, no, no, no. It's a daily journey. Um, and it's a tough, and it's a, and it's a tough one.

John Milham (Host) · 47:06

Yeah, absolutely. Maybe essentially though, cuz as you were about to tell us, right? Here you are, job has transitioned to a bit of a walk, and your body has turned on you.

The MRI shows something, the biopsy confirms it

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 47:18

Yeah, so the body, and that's what, and my health is kind of important to me. I enjoy what I do work-wise, and I enjoy leading a fairly healthy life. I cycle a lot and swim a lot and those things. So I enjoy leading that, leading that that kind of life. Suddenly all that was, was being pulled from under me. Health-wise, well, that, this legal thing, I just thought I gotta park that. Health was getting bad at, at a rapid rate was, was the health thing. This thing that I kept saying, no, you got the wrong guy. That does, um, it's not gonna happen. MRI was bad. They then send you on to, so I'm now working closely with an amazing surgeon. Um, who said, I want to get you into a biopsy as, as quick as we can. I didn't even know what a, what a biopsy was. So a biopsy. Basically, yeah, they're gonna drill holes in, in my, in my prostate to determine, yeah, just to pull out basically cancer cells to see the extent. One, is it cancer? Because at this stage still there's a lump there. We, we don't know whether it's cancer. We don't know whether it's, it's gonna be growing. We know nothing about it. So, um, so then we go into this biopsy. I was going into, so at this stage I'm going into MRIs. And even that, talk about imposter syndrome, you, you suddenly, I'm a cancer patient. So I'm sitting in Royal North Shore Hospital and there's the area where you sit to, um, you know, get x-rays and whatnot. And then there's this door at the back where cancer patients go through, um, and whatnot, because they've got to go into this other area. And I remember looking in the past, looking at that door going, ah, that's, you know, those poor people going in there. That's terrible. Rara. Suddenly I'm going through that door thinking, this is, this is not right. Like something's, something's gone wrong here. You got the wrong person. It's amazing how my mind was, was coping with it saying this, this just can't be right. You got the wrong person, guys. You put my name on a form and it's meant to be someone else. I was totally just saying this cannot be real. Biopsy comes, you know, and this is right through the MRI. So they find this, this growth. I'm like, yeah, it'll be nothing, guys. It'll be nothing. Going into the biopsy, so they put you under and whatnot. So it's a day surgery and I'm still thinking going in, this, this can't be right. Come out of that. Um, and the surgeon says, we've got to wait for the results, but this is what I do. I, I, I look after cancer patients. Get yourself ready. This, this, you, you've got, you got cancer, you know, prostate cancer. 'Cause he could see it in my eyes. I'm like saying, no, this can't be real. Um, and we get, and that was amazing. You know, talk about the, you know, important to me and, you know, family and whatnot, family, faith, and friends, I guess sums me up. Um, my daughter, some of my wife was at work. My daughter picked me up after surgery. And so she's there helping her dad now come out of, yeah, prostate biopsy. It does, it does damage to your waterworks and all sorts of stuff and my daughter helped me through some amazing times. So this poor young girl that literally now a few weeks ago was getting married and I was walking down the aisle is now walking me down the aisle of a hospital trying to, trying to help me. So, incredible how life changes. So anyway, biopsy came through. They give, for those that have been down the path, give a Gleason score, a Gleason score of, of, of how size of your cancer, I guess, and how aggressively it's growing. And, and a Gleason score, anything below 6, they don't even bother scoring, which is, which is great. Um, 7, 8, they go, yeah, let's monitor, this is not looking good. 9, 9, 10, it's like, this is aggressively growing, we gotta move quick. Well, I scored a 9 outta 10 for once in my life. I got a really, really high score. Um, so, um, so that was, yeah, not, not a time you wanna get a 90% mark. So, um, So that was, that was, that was a shock. So I'm sitting again back in the doctor's surgery. You get to know your surgeons well by this stage, as anyone who's been through this knows. And, um, and sitting in Justin's office and he said, okay, this is it. And you're in the highest level of cancer here. And we got to move quickly. In fact, he was that told me about it. He had booked the surgery and everything else. He said, I've booked you in. So straight after the biopsy, before we got the results. He said, Paul, I'm booking you. I've seen, don't worry, you can cancel it all, Paul. It's all good, but I'm booking you in for surgery because we need to get going on this. I'm like, okay, book it in, but I think it'll still be okay. Still, I was telling myself this. Anyway, Gleason score 9 out of 10. That's bad. That means this thing is aggressively growing. And now we go down the next path. It could have, the tumor could have extended beyond the prostate. And if once it goes beyond the prostate, it starts spreading quickly. So, um, so then we go through that again, surreal moments in life. A couple of months ago, you're walking your daughter down the aisle. Now I'm sitting in an office and they're saying, we've got to put you in for a, what is it? PSMA PET scan. Um, so it's the, you know, putting you in radioactive dye and run you through the big machine and it lights up like a Christmas tree when you got cancer through your body. So they started booking that in. Um, and then, but that's when they start giving you this material about prostate cancer and if it's spread and saying, you know, this is what we'll do next. And if we do that, we may be able to give you another 5 years of life. I'm just like, what? What are you telling me? I'm like, you're saying that if this is spread, then I may only have 5 years. Would, yeah, we need to start talking about this stuff now. I can't describe, I don't even know how I was thinking at that time. Again, I, I think my coping mechanism was, this isn't real. Again, a few months ago, great job, marketing director of a $1.4 billion organization, very successful year behind us and everything else. Walked my daughter down the aisle. Now I'm sitting in an office and they're telling me, you may only have, if we can do these things, we might be able to give you another 5 years of life. It's just like you this cannot, cannot be happening. By now I'm convinced, okay, that's happening. So I couldn't deny it any longer. I had to start to, but that was some dark times. That was some very dark, dark times when they did me that stuff. We talk about the transition, you know, there are good transitions and they're bad.

Told he might have five years, then learning the cancer is contained

John Milham (Host) · 53:53

That was so abrupt from on top of the world, conference, wedding, right into this. Being told that you may be able to squeeze another 5 years out. That's— you've obviously handled it. You've run that deep dive and you're sort of getting through, but what was essential for you to manage to get through that? You know, where, what made the difference?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 54:18

I wish I could sit here going, yeah, my faith held me strong and it might not, and it possibly did. I was scared. I'm going to be honest, man. I, I, others talk about knowing my faith and I'm, and I, and I was ready for the next step. And, and if, and if God told me, I was scared. I was, I was scared. What was I scared? I, I, you know, again, I've talked a lot about family and I was probably scared, Steph, of missing those milestones. Um, in the middle of all this. So, so I'm now at this point, my older daughter has her third child. So then I get this. Ray of sunshine through it all. And this is, this is the challenge now I've been on. I'm sure others have been on is I absolutely ray of sunshine. So this new little girl, absolutely stunning, beautiful and everything else, but I couldn't, I was now going into that dark spot where I wasn't, um, and I'm still working to come out of that. Um, I couldn't find happiness in anything because I was scared. I was like, Yeah, this is beautiful, but I'm not going to see you go to school and I'm not going to see you do these things. It was, it is brutal. And that fear hangs, that fear hangs. I mean, I still talk to a psychologist about it and that fear of something's going to go wrong is real. So I was in a terrible moment where I'd be, um, you know, in the backyard pool with all my, with my kids and my kids' kids and, you know, a wonderful, wonderful time. And I was just not happy or sad. I was just, just holding flat. So no more Heisel. I was just holding flat because I just couldn't comprehend. I, I actually— what was I thinking? I couldn't comprehend what was going on. I just couldn't, couldn't fathom. I was just— but the, the— what I did do, I guess the only— the, the learnings through that time is I forced myself to keep going. I kept training, you know. It would be so— I, I going out, people would say, oh, do you want to come out for dinner? And I did not want to go out. Didn't, I just wanted to sit in the dark room by myself, but I kept going out, would talk to people a bit, a bit about what I'm going on. And only now am I talking a lot more about it. Um, but I just, but I had to force myself to stay in life because man, I was ready to shut off from life. Like, could have so easily just, I don't want to see no one. I sit in a dark room. Um, yeah, this, this is— it got me bad. It got me bad physically, mentally. Yeah, it got me bad. Never thought— did I have thoughts of doing any harm? No, no, which is great. But I was certainly, certainly very close to bunkering down. I didn't do it. I never did it. I forced myself to go out and I'd say to my wife, you know, I don't want to go to this. She said, no, I'd rather sit at home as well, but we can't keep doing that. We've got to get on with life. And we did. And we, and we did. So, um, so we're learning. Yeah. Yeah. Push. Again, if I go back, friends, family, faith was so important. So we, we, we held onto those three things tightly through times when we didn't want to, we didn't lose my faith. No, no. But, um, it, it was challenging to go. It was, it was challenging to go, but amazing, amazing. That support that we got at times where I was so weak. Mentally, um, I knew there was others that were thinking of me and I have a lot of faith and praying for me. Um, knowing that was going on did give me a level of peace going, okay, like, I'm in no condition to do it, but I know others are, and that's good. And that, that was, that was good enough. So, um, so yeah, we, um, beautiful baby. Two weeks later, um, yeah, I'm getting ready for surgery. Went away with a beautiful group of friends literally the weekend I was going into surgery on the Tuesday, we went away for the weekend. And again, we ummed and ahhed. This is a trip that had been booked 12 months ago, um, out to Mudgee wine tasting and whatnot. And again, so did not want to go to that, but it was important. It was important. Those people, uh, were incredibly special and it was important to just keep pushing and living life brutally, brutally hard, but very very, very, very close and caring people that I've known for a couple of mates there, probably known for 50 years. Um, so no, very special people. So we kept going with life, but then yeah, surgery was coming. So, um, so let me know. I've jumped ahead. The PET, the PET scans. I remember dark, very dark times for probably 3, 4 weeks and driving there. So my wife obviously came with me to this meeting. Um, and a lot of the hospital visits she, she didn't because she needed to keep going with life. Um, um, she's in medical as well, health services, so she needed to keep working. So, um, this one she did come and we, I don't think we said a word in the car because this was, this was going to be scary. Had it spread beyond the prostate and if it did, they look, they're very encouraging. They say, yeah, we'll still do this and then we'll do radio and chemo and all those things. But, um, we knew that if it had spread down there beyond the prostate, this was going to be A real battle. It changes things. Arrived there and had a long story short. Yeah, it, it, at this, what's their wording? At this stage, they can detect no sign of leakage beyond the prostate. So, that I'll never forget. The drive was dead silent going there. We just sat and it's incredibly, incredibly like, again, surreal. You never imagine in your life sitting there being told Yeah, we— so I said to him, you've given me all this material about 5 years and what we need to do. So why did you do that? He said, we need— we actually have to, otherwise we get the other side saying you should have briefed me better on what was going on. So we actually tell you that. But I said, so what's it mean? He said, well, okay, we believe it's largely contained. Uh, we, we, we won't know for years, but we believe it's largely contained. Um, now you, you've got two options: surgery or or radiotherapy. And again, we went down that and spoke to many people and Dr. Google and spent many, many hours researching papers and whatnot. It was coming clear and clear. And the big message to me, and again, mine was contained within a prostate, was the doctor said to me, he said, think about all your options, but I'll leave you with one thing. There are literally hundreds of thousands of people cancer patients that are sitting in rooms getting chemo today, wishing they had an operable cancer. Paul, you have cancer. It is an operable cancer. What that means is we can cut it out with a reasonable degree of confidence that we're gonna get pretty much all of it. They would dream to be in your situation today. You are considering putting yourself in their situation where you do radio or chemo, um, and try and fight it. They would love to just cut the bastard out of them. And, and that was, that was really, and I will never forget that, is, is freaking get this. If, if I, you had a chance to get this bastard out, if you get this, this nasty thing out of you, yes, there's implications of losing your prostate and, and, and, and affecting the area of things down there, um, around your urinary tract and everything. Well, they actually cut your whole urinary tract, but, but it was like, yeah, yes, you're a cancer patient. Yes, realize that, but we, we can operate on this and get rid of the core of the problem, then we'll do other things later. So, um, so that was, um, that was the learning is, you know, now I find myself in that imposter syndrome where I talk about being a, a cancer patient, but I feel as though I'm, I'm not compared to what others are going through. Um, I just feel as though, no, I'm, I'm not worthy to be even classed in, in their level of of cancer because there's people suffering 1,000 times more than me. So the PET scan was good. There was no— didn't line up. I could— Christian was very, very focused. A couple of points that may have possible leakage, which we'll see what happens in life. But so that was amazing. So then we come to say, then we decided on surgery, went down all those paths, talked to many people, people that had regrets about having their prostate removed. Yeah. So I went down, you know, talked to a lot of people. Another very close friend. It's amazing how things, very close friend. He was probably on the same journey as me. We had no idea that we're on this, but you know, we then got chatting. He was on the same journey as me, probably 7 weeks in front of me. So that was, that was interesting to share that journey and it's brought us very close together again, a beautiful, beautiful person. And again, amazing business person in creative, in advertising and everything else. So similar fields. Um, but just phenomenal. So he was on the same journey. So we get to surgery. Um, well, I guess surgery went, went well. Um, you know, it is as well as a surgery removal of the prostate can be, but it's surreal. Well, I mean, again, that weekend I'm away with friends and drinking wine and whatnot. And by Tuesday, they're, they're wheeling me in to do me. And I don't do a ton of homework on the surgery, but it's, it's pretty massive, uh, intrusive. Surgery. It is major. They basically cut in through your stomach to, um, get it. I did robotic surgery. Um, you look at health insurance, we had Top Health Insurance. It doesn't cover the best form of, you know, and that's a whole nother subject for another day. Um, you have to pay to get the best. You had to pay for it out of pocket. So we were digging in deep to our savings. My father, um, helped me a lot, um, and, and, and paid for a lot of the surgery because we wanted to have the best, this robotic surgery, which isn't covered under your health insurance. So that, again, brutal things occur. So you've lost your job, you've got cancer, costs are going absolutely, absolutely through the roof in surgery, but you want to do the best. So we're prepared to do that. We're coming up to surgery, jump back 3, no, about a month or so before, you know, while we're going through this, we said, let's put our house on the market. So we were kind of like, because we didn't have enough going on, we said, Yeah, let's sell the family home. So we did throw that into the mix as well. And now why do we do that? Why do we do that? Because it sounds a stupid thing to do. We had always had a dream of downsizing and moving to the Northern Beaches. We're living in Putney near Gladesville. So we had, so we really start to go, let's get on with life. You know, let's not sit back. So at a crazy time in life, yeah, we did put the house on the market to the point where I was in hospital. Well, I was actually coming out of hospital., you know, um, catheter, urine bag attached to my leg, 5 different incisions through your stomach, a major one up the middle, 5 others around it. So massive intrusion. I was a mess. We had an open house that morning, so I'm, uh, waiting in the reception area of the hospital for my wife to pick me up, and she's getting the house ready for an open house that day. Um, it was just, yeah, crazy the things we do. We knew at a time we, it would take a pressure off if we actually sold the house. So we did have a mortgage and whatnot, and we didn't know what life was gonna bring.

Surgery, recovery, and selling the family home

John Milham (Host) · 1:05:19

Even though the challenge of selling a house, it, you know, it was that said, that's almost a cathartic process of moving forward anyway.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:05:26

That's what we thought. Yeah, that's exactly what we thought is, is let's get on with our life. So it wasn't, it wasn't crazy. Yes, financially it was gonna take a pressure off. But also we were, it was a point of getting on with our life. Our vision was, you know, could we downsize? So all our kids had moved out now. Could we downside get to the Northern Beaches, which we were going to do in a few years' time. This just accelerated things. One, financially, we weren't sure where things were going. Health-wise, we're like, let's not wait another few years. We don't know where that will be. So probably through these dark times of gee, we don't know what the next 5 years is going to be. Like we said, let's get on with life then. So it was, you're right, mate, it probably was cathartic to say, let's let's sell the home and get on with our lives and living our dreams a little bit as well. So yeah, we did that, which is crazy. Yeah.

John Milham (Host) · 1:06:20

Well, mate, crazy, but now we're a little bit further on.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:06:24

So now we're further on and let's cut to that. So we ended up horrendous experience in selling the home, one agent disaster of a campaign. Then we met a beautiful agent who's had an amazing story. Talk about heroes. He lost his daughter to cancer. When she was 4 years old. And so met this guy, shared our stories. I was in the middle of, yeah, horrendous cancer story, but we shared our stories and I said, mate, after that, I want you to sell my home. I believe in what you do from a marketing sense. I believe in you as a person and we are good friends and we, my wife and I help his charity out now and we're volunteers for his charity. A real estate agent that we met. Talk about how I behave and just being kind to others. He was my real estate agent, but we've done as much as we can to give back to him because he's going through some challenges in life, him and his wife. So we've done that. Sold the house, which was tremendous. Came out of surgery. Look, mate, things are going okay. I'm now on this crazy journey. So surgery went well. I've recovered well. I'm out. I'm learning to live life without prostate and recovering from that. But I'm back on the bike and back training. I'm back, yeah, running and whatnot. So, um, which, which is great. We're, we're now on this crazy journey. The next 2 years, every 12 weeks I get tested, uh, to, for, for prostate cancer as to, you know, is my PSA level rising again? Is there cells floating around through the body that are starting to, to grow again? So, um, I got 2 years of every 12 week, 12 weeks of testing, and then another 3 years after that. Of every 6 months and testing before they say, yes, you're cancer-free. So, um, so even that, I feel again, so I'm talking about someone else's life, until 5 years where they say, yes, you're, you're cleared now, ring the bell, you're cancer-free. Um, it just feels surreal saying that, like, that, that's what other people do, not me. But I, I am on that journey, um, and we'll see where that journey It takes us, work-wise, it's taken me a while. I've had to work hard to get the confidence back physically and mentally as to how I'm going to go. It knocked me. While I think I'm strong at times, this did knock me that a workplace would do that to someone. I'll be honest, I've been into places for interviews and I am maybe too honest and I've said, Guys, yeah, I finished work last year, you know, did end up being diagnosed with prostate cancer, blah, blah, blah, but hey, I'm raring to go. Um, 3 occasions, uh, 3 occasions, 3 separate occasions, I've had feedback through recruiters saying they are concerned about your cancer and whether you'll be able to, um, do the job required. Um, I wasn't expecting that. I never imagined that. I'm like, you kidding me? You got people in there that probably got all sorts of stuff. I'm actually. Had surgery and ready to move forward. But I get it. I get it. They got concerns. I hope I never treat anyone that way, but it's real. So that's real. Well, I'm starting a new contract on Monday with a company. That'll be interesting. Yeah, that'll be interesting how that goes. Do I feel as though I can do it? I know what needs to to be done. They do know a bit about my journey. I think it's held them back, but I'm just going to go in. Yeah, this is the start of my new chapter. So, my new chapter last year was massive ups and downs. We end up selling our home. We now live in a fantastic place in Narrabeen, which is incredible, like literally a miracle. Start a new job on Monday, just a 6-month contract, so that'll be good to see where that goes. So, um, 12 months to the day, I have now recovering, yeah, from surgery and cancer, starting a new job. And we're, it was literally my daughter's wedding anniversary on the weekend. Gonna get upset again. And we're talking about the year that we've, we've been on.

John Milham (Host) · 1:10:35

Is it a, is it a really awful year or, you know, is there, other aspects to it.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:10:41

Mate, I have sold my house, moved into a fantastic place on the Northern Beaches. My beautiful young daughter got married to a wonderful guy. She told us in December that she's pregnant, expecting her first baby in June. My older daughter married, she's got 3 kids now, had a third while we're in the middle of all this, um, amazing, incredible positives. Like, like my daughter is on an amazing, my younger daughter, amazing journey with a wonderful guy. Um, as I say, I have got a faith and they've, they've, they've got a beautiful faith though, those two, and I've got a great group that they connect with, um, that, that support each other through, through, through their church and that. So, um, incredibly blessed. Um, but then lows that I never never could comprehend, and I would wish upon no one, no one, the lows of being told that, yeah, yeah, your clock's really ticking aggressively and you may, you may only have 5 years. I would never want anyone to have to go through that kind of thinking. And I know they do, mate. And I feel selfish that I'm saying that. Yeah, totally. And I said, I feel incredibly selfish. I actually feel selfish where I am today because I'm incredibly blessed and I'm moving forward. And at this stage, you know, I'm hopeful. I've been around for a bloody long time. So the highs of highs and the lows of lows has been in 12 months, not in a lifetime, in 12 months. I'm hoping, mate, for a year of a little bit of peace. Literally, my hope is, and I talk about peace, I just want some peace now.

A year of highs and lows, and what comes next

John Milham (Host) · 1:12:25

What do you now know about navigating the highs and the lows?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:12:31

The, the, the, my big takeout, my big takeout is, is don't change anything about me. Even through the lows of lows, I didn't want to be telling people about me. I realize it's important too, so I realize that it's important too, but I want the, the, the, the cathartic thing for me was how can I help others? Was my focus. So, I think that anchor of that selflessness that we talked right back from the start of my dad and mom and everything else, that's the thing that keeps me going. I've been working on a project over the last few months now with a very close friend called My Acts of Kindness where— and what's that? It's really a movement of just trying to be kind to others. It's not about raising money. The currency is kindness and paying that forward if I can buy someone a coffee that's just sitting at a table and they might go, hey, that's really nice. I'm going to do that for someone else. It's really creating a movement. My learning out of it is those little tiny acts of kindness, that phone call when I was in the deepest, darkest moment, not to have a long chat because I didn't want to talk to anyone for long periods of time, but just say, hi mate, we're thinking of you. Just wanted to let you know. A text message to say, hi mate, thinking of you. Just want to let you know we're praying for you. Those little acts of kindness is actually the thing that I want to take forward. And as I say, we're actually creating an organization where we're going to encourage my acts of kindness, give them software and everything else to be able to do acts of kindness with others, but share them. Share them isn't saying, hey, look what I did today. It's actually encouraging a movement of doing small acts of kindness. So that's what we're in the process of setting up. And that's my takeout of all this is how can I continue that movement of doing just small acts of kindness for others? Because everyone, I mean, you know, I've had a hell of a journey, um, but, but so has everyone else. So has everyone else. And I'm kidding myself. I'm blessed. I'm blessed. I'm, I'm the, uh, been a journey, but I'm blessed. There's others that are, uh, yeah, every day can need, need a hand. And if I can just help someone in the tiniest way, then then that could create a movement of that person wanting to help someone else and we pass it on from there. So, um, no, mate, I bizarrely find myself still blessed. Um, surreal year. Yeah. Still on a journey. Don't know where it's going to take us, but, um, what do I want to do moving forward? I said, you know, what am I about? I want to make a difference. I've probably been doing that a lot in workplace and with my family and whatnot. Um, Now I want to make a difference in other people's lives, whether it's the person at the supermarket and just say, hi, how are you today? I hope you have a wonderful day. You can make a difference in every person's life. And yeah, hoping I can do that more. I got a long way to go, but hopefully I'll do that more.

John Milham (Host) · 1:15:24

Well, mate, you know, the increasing your circle of influence is a worthy outcome from the bumps and bounces of life, right? And that's my take on it. Like I said, make it sound important, but I think your story is a great way to launch My Acts of Kindness from a concept point of view, right? So what is it but the gifts that we've been given, let's pass them on.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:15:57

That's all it is. That's all it is. And it can be tiny, tiny things. That's the beauty about my— it's not a charity where we're donating millions of dollars. It's actually, there's no money involved in it. It's actually just doing something special for someone else in a very, very small way can create a movement and we can change the world. We can make a difference in the world by doing small things of thinking for others.

John Milham (Host) · 1:16:20

Well, I believe you and I am grateful, so very grateful for Paul, for sharing what has been an energetic and amazingly interesting story. Mate, the imposter, if they all have a good yarn like yours, mate, I'll only deal with imposters.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:16:37

Let's hope we're all imposters. If we all get charged with being too nice to each other, then what a great world we'd have.

John Milham (Host) · 1:16:43

Yeah, please be that my crime, right?

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:16:49

Please be that my crime. Love it.

John Milham (Host) · 1:16:52

Mate, fantastic. Thank you so much for bravely sharing. And I acknowledge the fact that you're still on a journey and that that will be a part of your life, but I am incredibly inspired by the way you're integrating that into building something better from that, right? So congratulations, mate. And thank you so much from Kintsugi Heroes. We really appreciate you sharing this story.

Paul Tredinnick (Guest) · 1:17:14

Thanks, brother. We hope you've enjoyed this episode of Kintsugi Heroes. Please like and share the show to your friends so we can get this out to even more people. If you have a story you'd like to share with us, please reach out using the contact details below. And join us next week for our next heroes' story. Until then, keep being you, and remember that we are all heroes in our own unique way. Only when it's broken, only when it's broken. When it hits you in the middle of the night and the truth burns so bright. Only when it's broken, only when it's broken. Take pride in those cries, it's only for tonight, and then you rise. Only when you're broken, only when you're broken, only when you're broken.

Terminated Employment & Challenging Surgeries after Cancer Diagnosis with Paul Tredinnick

Overview

Chapters

Welcome to Kintsugi Heroes

A career that looked like success from the outside

The accounting cadetship that lasted five weeks

Learning to speak like a teacher in the boardroom

The childhood illness that taught him about sacrifice

Moving to Ballarat for the experience, not the job title

Being told he was too nice for corporate success

A wedding, then a call about PSA levels

Terminated, one week after the cancer diagnosis begins

The MRI shows something, the biopsy confirms it

Told he might have five years, then learning the cancer is contained

Surgery, recovery, and selling the family home

A year of highs and lows, and what comes next

In Paul Tredinnick's words

Paul Tredinnick, today

Common questions

Is this a true story?

What organisation produced this?

What did Paul Tredinnick learn from this experience?

What would Paul Tredinnick want listeners to know?

What helped Paul Tredinnick most along the way?

What would Paul Tredinnick tell someone going through something similar?

Transcript

Welcome to Kintsugi Heroes

Support

Coping with Cancer Diagnosis & Treatment with Ian Westmoreland & Kathleen Langmore

Leading a community with empathy, and managing media misinformation with Peter Hunter

Karen Humphries' Unique Journey Through Chronic Illness

What topics does this episode cover?

A career that looked like success from the outside

The accounting cadetship that lasted five weeks

Learning to speak like a teacher in the boardroom

The childhood illness that taught him about sacrifice

Moving to Ballarat for the experience, not the job title

Being told he was too nice for corporate success

A wedding, then a call about PSA levels

Terminated, one week after the cancer diagnosis begins

The MRI shows something, the biopsy confirms it

Told he might have five years, then learning the cancer is contained

Surgery, recovery, and selling the family home

A year of highs and lows, and what comes next