Anne Gately · 57 min
Anne Gately survived a Stage IV melanoma diagnosis that lit her skeleton up like a Christmas tree, and in 97 days went from terminal prognosis to no active cancer, then turned that miracle into a national mission to change Australia's sun-safety culture.
Hear this story
Anne Gately grew up at Coogee Beach doing what most Australian kids did in the 1970s and 80s: swimming, playing sport, and spending long days in the sun without protection. Sunburn was normal. Peeling skin meant you'd had a good summer. It wasn't until she was in her 40s, after 13 years without a skin check, that a dermatologist found melanoma on her back. Surgery removed it, and for eight years she was clear. Then the pain started. What felt like a pulled muscle spread across her entire body, and doctors missed it for weeks. A bone scan revealed the cancer had returned and spread throughout her skeleton like a Christmas tree lit up in red. She was 48, with two teenage sons, facing a stage 4 diagnosis that carried a 12 to 24-month prognosis. In 97 days of aggressive immunotherapy, the cancer disappeared completely. Only 50% of people with advanced melanoma respond to this treatment. She was one of them. But survival brought something unexpected: guilt that others didn't make it, and anger at the culture that had shaped her carelessness about sun safety. She saw loved ones sunbaking after everything she'd been through. She watched marketing campaigns glorify tanning. As an advertising professional, she realised there were no industry guidelines protecting sun safety. So she turned her second chance into a mission. She wrote a memoir, appeared in a documentary, and started pushing for real change: shade in playgrounds, sun safety policies in sports clubs, curricula in high schools where melanoma actually is the cancer most likely to affect 20 to 40-year-olds. The gold in her fracture is the work still ahead.
“In 97 days, I went from being lit up like a Christmas tree to no cancer.”
“I felt shame. Because I felt that it was because of my own behavior that I was in this situation.”
“It's not just a me problem — some protection — it's a we problem, it's a system problem.”
The hero, today
Sunburn in childhood raises your risk of melanoma regardless of skin type, and the more burns you get, the higher that risk becomes. Only 50 per cent of people with advanced melanoma respond to immunotherapy; some see it stabilise like a chronic disease, and some do not respond at all, which is why skin cancer remains preventable rather than curable. Skin cancer kills more Australians each year than road accidents, yet it does not receive the same media attention or public urgency, which is why system-level change in schools, sporting clubs, and outdoor industries is essential. What helped Anne get through stage 4 melanoma was psychological flexibility: accepting her reality, processing her emotions through poetry rather than pushing them down, acting according to her values, focusing on what she could still do, and being deliberate about how she spent her energy. High schools lose sun safety entirely after junior school, at the exact moment when teenagers become independent and most influenced by social media, and melanoma is the single cancer most likely to affect 20 to 40-year-olds. Organisations from media companies to sports clubs ask for wet-weather gear to protect staff from rain but do not provide sun protection like hats or sunscreen, despite the fact that UV exposure is more likely to be fatal than getting wet.
Yes. Anne Gately is a real person who shared their own story in their own words. Kintsugi Heroes is a not-for-profit that shares first-person stories of overcoming adversity, told with the person's consent.
Kintsugi Heroes, a registered Australian not-for-profit. Every story is shared with the hero's own consent and reviewed under Kintsugi Heroes' trauma-informed content standard before it goes public.
Sunburn in childhood raises your risk of melanoma regardless of skin type, and the more burns you get, the higher that risk becomes.
Only 50 per cent of people with advanced melanoma respond to immunotherapy; some see it stabilise like a chronic disease, and some do not respond at all, which is why skin cancer remains preventable rather than curable.
Skin cancer kills more Australians each year than road accidents, yet it does not receive the same media attention or public urgency, which is why system-level change in schools, sporting clubs, and outdoor industries is essential.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 00:01
Welcome to the Grit Diaries with Mon and Maz, a place where we share real stories meets real transformation. Each episode, we share the journeys of everyday people who's faced life's hardest moments and found their way to hope, healing, and purpose. May their courage inspire you and in the world around you. Let's get inspired. Oh, we've got a great episode for you today and one that you're not going to want to miss. Today we have the incredible Anne Gately. She is a crusader and ambassador for sun safety, and she will be sharing her journey of her own experience with stage 4 melanoma, how she survived this. You'll want to stay tuned. It is an incredible story, an incredible journey, and as a result, she has become become an ambassador to really get us all to think about how we think about our own son's safety. She's been involved in a documentary, and she's an absolute wealth of wisdom. She is a woman on a mission. She's in the public eye, she's in the media, and here we get to go behind the scenes and just get to hear about her own personal journey and why this is important for all of us to really take notice and look after ourselves and those that we care about and our community. So with no further ado, we welcome Anne. Well, hello everyone, welcome to the Grit Diaries with Mon and Maz. Hi, Mon. G'day, Maz. Hello, great to be back. And here we are with the most amazing Anne Gately. And welcome to the show.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 01:54
Thank you so much for having me.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 01:56
Yeah, well, we're really looking forward to sharing your story today. And, uh, just a little bit of a background on Anne. Anne is sharing her story in her melanoma journey. Melanoma that was diagnosed as grade 4 in 2018 and with about 12 to 24 months prognosis, which is pretty serious. And unbelievably, with treatment with immunotherapy, incredibly survived that journey and clearly is here to tell the story. She has chosen to take up the advocacy role in really changing the landscape, particularly for Australians that have a very high case of melanomas. And she's been an advocate. She's written her book, Sunburnt, which is a memoir on her journey as a child and having that typical beautiful Australian life that we have all lived. We live on on the beaches ourselves, and we know what that's like, and the good old Aussie, Aussie tan that we get. And it's, yeah, been quite a journey. And so she's canvassed a lot of TV, radio in terms of advocacy and helping us change how we view dealing with sun safety. And we really look forward to sharing your story. I believe that you've also been part of a documentary as well and has been really really powerful in 2024. So, and you've also created Adapt in regards to looking at how we can change how we deal with the different stresses. So we'll unpack that a little bit later. So, but thank you for everything that you're doing, Anne. And I guess we just really wanted to start with what life was like for you. I think that you probably emulate a lot of people's stories growing up in Australia on the beaches. So could you let us know a little bit about what that was like and I guess what idea of, you know, sun safety was back then and how it's evolved over time?
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What helped Anne get through stage 4 melanoma was psychological flexibility: accepting her reality, processing her emotions through poetry rather than pushing them down, acting according to her values, focusing on what she could still do, and being deliberate about how she spent her energy.
This conversation includes growing up a water baby at coogee beach, the slip slop slap years and teenage sun worship, a mole that prompts a skin check, the words that changed her life, eight years clear, then pain that won't stop and a bone scan lit up like a christmas tree.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 04:03
Yeah, so as you said, I grew up on the beach. I grew up on Coogee Beach in the eastern suburbs. And I was the baby. I was born the only girl to 3 older brothers. And I was born into a swimming family. So I just, you know, did what my brothers did. I wanted to do what they did. So went to swimming training in the morning, in the afternoon, and in the house I was born into, my dad had built a pool which was made out of bricks. And we were just, you know, I was just a water baby from the very outset. We went to swimming club. I learned to swim at Wiley's, which is a beautiful rock pool at Coogee. We'd go to swimming club as a family and My brothers were all competitive in surf lifesaving, and back then in those days, they competed every weekend at surf carnivals around Sydney. So I would tag along because I love to just spend my time, you know, mucking around in the swell at all the different beaches that we would visit. Now, I grew up in the days before Slip, Slop, Slap, and sun protection was kind of a swipe of zinc across your nose, and there might have been a sheen of Hawaiian Tropic oil or even baby oil. The good old baby oil, the coconut oil.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 05:32
I can smell it.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 05:34
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, I felt I hadn't had a good summer unless my nose had peeled at least once. That was, you know, just the way it was. When I got into my teen years, I did what a lot of people people do that grow up on the beaches. You, your whole social life is connected to the beach. You hang at the beach all weekend and all summer holidays. You gossip and sunbathe and try to catch the eye of that cute guy. And you know, that's what our life was. I was probably about 16 before Slip, Slop, Slap was launched. And because I was at that age, at that teenage years, you don't really listen to that kind of, you know, advertising or messaging. So I was just an outdoorsy kind of person. I played a lot of sport, like netball, softball, tennis. My dad loved to barbecue. So, you know, we were just outdoors a lot. And we didn't really worry too much about the sun. And I think that, you know, my upbringing is pretty common to a lot of Australians' upbringing. Upbringing. And even if you didn't live on the beach, you might have lived out in the country, or you might have lived in outer suburbs, but you still— you know, Australians, we love to spend a lot of time outdoors. And I think it's very common.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 06:58
That's right. I don't think unique to the beaches. Everywhere people were out. We weren't sitting inside on computers and podcasts, were we? And I think, and as well, I can relate to what you're saying. I can still remember peeling off shards of skin off my nose and off my back and being at a school carnival, and I ended up with burns on my ankles just from them sitting out in the sun and going to the doctor's that night. And, but no one really sort of thought, oh my gosh, that's terrible. And what that may have been doing, which perhaps in your story, you know, the burns that were happening when you were younger were actually contributing to what you were diagnosed later. Is that what you, is that what happened?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 07:41
Well, yes, you are, as a child, you're very vulnerable because your skin is different. And the research does show that sunburn is the— you know, if you're sunburnt, you are at higher risk of getting melanoma. So I guess the more burns you get too, the more, you know, the higher that risk is for you. And that's probably regardless of skin type, because if you're burnt, you're burnt.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 08:11
So I guess fast forwarding. So, you know, you definitely highlighted, you know, very typical Aussie upbringing, not uncommon. Myself in my nursing career, you know, I then go back a generation prior to that with all the patients that I look after. A lot of the older men in their sort of 80s and they're dealing with unbelievable melanomas on their legs, on their backs, on their ears, on their heads because they worked outdoors. Very much their outdoors lifestyle. So, you know, it's obviously still, you know, it's happening. They're being discovered later in life. So I think that really speaks to what you're saying is that, yes, you know, that early exposure does make a big impact later down the track. So what happened with you and with what made you sort of think, oh, that mole or what did you discover enough to actually then get you into a doctor's office? To get something checked?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 09:11
Well, the first time I was diagnosed with melanoma, I hadn't been for a skin check for about 13 years, and I was pretty moley. I had quite a lot of moles on my back, and I'd heard the story of someone that, you know, I knew thirdhand kind of thing, and someone said, oh, so-and-so was really lucky and found a mole just before it went nasty. And I thought, oh, I haven't had a skin check for a while, so maybe I should go and do that. So I took myself off to get a skin check, and they removed an unsightly mole that I had that people always commented on saying, have you had that checked? Apart from the fact that it was really ugly. And then I also had a biopsy done, and I had to wait a couple of weeks to go back and have the stitches out and get the results from that biopsy.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 10:04
Sorry to interrupt you, and just for our listeners, for those people that are sitting there thinking, oh, you know, and they've got a mole, was it you went to the GP and then the GP referred you to someone to get that biopsy done?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 10:17
Okay, well, yeah, I specifically went to the GP and just asked for a referral to a dermatologist, which was my choice. And that's because I knew I had a lot of moles. So I wanted to go to someone that I thought was looking at moles every day. So the dermatologist did the biopsy. I went back 2 weeks later and that's when, you know, basically she said the words that changed my life, that you have melanoma. And it was on a mole on my back and I was just in shock. My knees, my legs went like jelly and my stomach churned and tears streamed down my face. And this is back in 2010 and I didn't know a hell of a lot about melanoma, but I did know it was bad and it could be fatal. And at the time, I have two sons and they were 7 and 10. And the overriding emotional feeling that I had with that diagnosis was that I felt shame.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 11:29
Why shame?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 11:30
Well, because I felt that it was because of my own behavior that I was in this situation. And I thought I didn't— I just felt shame about the possibility that I would leave my two young sons, you know, if I was to, you know, if I was to die from this diagnosis, that I would be leaving my two young sons behind, and I felt it was very much because of my own behavior. So I subsequently had surgery to remove that melanoma from my back, and they took a couple of lymph nodes from under my arm to see whether or not the melanoma had spread. And thankfully for me, it hadn't. So I pretty much went on and lived my life kind of as normally as I could after that. And the prescribed follow-ups was a skin check every 3 months for 5 years. And then after that, because the statistics show that the possibility of it returning, you know, had reduced after 5 years. I would then have a skin check every 6 months. So that's what I did for 8 years.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 12:46
So you went through immunotherapy, I believe.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 12:49
Yeah, I haven't got to that part of the story yet.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 12:54
Ah, you're still okay.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 12:57
So 8 years after the first diagnosis or the first melanoma, I came back from the gym and I had a sore back, and I thought I'd had poor form lifting some weights and thought I'd pulled a muscle. So I had some anti-inflammatories and paracetamol and waited for the pain to go away. It didn't go away, so I started going to the chiropractor, and the pain had traveled, so it was no longer just started on my shoulder where the original pain had come from. It started to spread all over my body, like through my torso, my arms, my legs, and there was no consistency in the pain. Sometimes it was a dull, aching pain. Other times it was like what I imagined, say, if you had an electric shock, like it just, you know, rushed through my body. And then I got to a point where getting out of bed was excruciating. It was like every one of my ribs was broken. So as I said, I went to the chiropractor, I went to a GP. I said, I'm not feeling very well. I've got this pain. Can you take some blood tests? They took blood tests. I got a text saying all good. And I then, I even tried a Bowen therapist. Like someone said, oh, maybe, you know, so I went to Bowen therapist. I went to, finally went to another GP. And she said, I think you could have an autoimmune disease. She sent me off to an endocrinologist. I spoke to him and he was the first one that asked me, because I downloaded my, you know, my medical history. He was the first one to ask to look at my melanoma site where I'd had the original one removed. And I thought, that's kind of weird, like why would he want to look there? And then he sent me off for a bone scan. And a couple of days— in fact, the day of the bone scan, I got a call, and I'd driven up to Blueys on the Mid North Coast to visit a girlfriend. And I had some missed calls from the doctor, and I thought, uh-oh, this isn't good. And I rang him, and he said, I've seen your bone scan You've got cancer and it's everywhere.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 15:25
Wow, they told you over the phone. Wow. Did you— and did you have— were you at your girlfriend's by then? Did you have anybody with you?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 15:35
Yeah, I was at my girlfriend's place, so I was with her, but he didn't know what cancer. He said, I don't think it's melanoma, it doesn't normally present like that. I think it could be a blood cancer. He said to me, stay up there, have a few days holiday, you know, and then come back. And I went, there's no way I'm having a holiday, like seriously. So I just arrived, I stayed the night and I didn't sleep much. I got up the next day and I drove straight back to Sydney and saw the doctor the next day. And he showed me the bone scan and it was literally like my skeleton was lit up like a Christmas tree. They were just red dots all over it. It took another couple of weeks before I would find out what the cancer was. So I had to end up— he sent me to a hematologist because he thought it was a blood thing. I had to have a bone biopsy. And then eventually I was told by the hematologist, he said to me, I'm sorry, it's melanoma. He said, I can't help you because that's not what I do, but if I was you, this is who I would go to. And he referred me to Professor Georgina Long, who was our joint Australian of the Year last year. So from the initial pain to finding out that I had melanoma took about, I don't know, 10 weeks to find out what was going on. And then once I had that diagnosis of melanoma, I was in to see Professor Georgina Long at the Melanoma Institute the next day.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 17:14
Ah, brilliant, great, excellent. And from the first melanoma that you found to the second diagnosis, what span of time are we looking at?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 17:24
8 years.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 17:25
8 years, wow, okay.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 17:27
Yeah, well, that's just what melanoma is like. Unfortunately, it is just very aggressive and it can keep coming back. And mine isn't an unusual story of, you know, being clear for that long and then having it come back. So we assume that my primary was the one that was found 8 years earlier because then it was just all through my bones. Can I just—
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 17:57
I know that you're talking to a nurse who's interviewing you, But for someone that's lay out there, like, you know, you're not in the medical world, and I'm not, what does it mean we assumed it's primary? So for me, even that's, you know, not— I, if I'm listening, I don't understand.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 18:15
So the primary is the first site of the melanoma.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 18:18
Right, yep.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 18:19
Because you had a lot of moles. When I had the second diagnosis, it didn't come like as a mole first or anything like that. It was just then all through my bones. Okay, so yeah, it's assumed that that was a result of that first one that was found.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 18:37
Great point, Mon. And also, I think it really speaks to making sure anyone that has already had a diagnosis for any kind of cancer, but particularly with the melanoma, to make sure that you are actually going back for those checks and not get complacent. So I think that's, you know, testament to your story. So thank you for sharing that, Ann. So gosh, what a journey, and, you know, having to go through it, and then with such volume this time, it was, you know, you've got your grade 4 diagnosis.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 19:09
Yeah, well, it's stage 4, yeah. Mm.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 19:14
So tell us, so you went through immunotherapy?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 19:19
Yep, so when I went to Melanoma Institute or Professor Georgina Long, they basically said, we're going to need to give you immunotherapy and we're going to have to give you the big guns because you have it all through your bones. You know, the strongest stuff we've got. So they originally spoke to me about going on a trial and they were quite enthusiastic about doing a trial. I think that was for two reasons, because other than being riddled with melanoma, I was, you know, completely healthy. I had no other comorbidities, you know, I didn't have any other chronic diseases. And also because they wanted to give me this immunotherapy, and under the way that the PBS was structured at the time, they actually were obliged to give me a different treatment first, even though they knew that this immunotherapy treatment was the one I needed. So I didn't end up going on a trial because when I had my first PET scan, which was the scan which identifies exactly where all the melanoma is, they found that there was a number of metastases on my skull and they wanted to get me onto treatment really quickly because they didn't want to chance any metastases going to the brain. Because when there are— when melanoma goes to the brain, historically the prognosis has been a lot worse. That is starting to change now. So I went on a 2-week treatment of a targeted treatment, and then I finished that and had scans again. So they had to do another baseline to see where things were at. And after that 2 weeks of treatment, there'd been reduction in my melanoma. So that was amazing.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 21:15
Very promising.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 21:16
Mm. Yeah. So then I got started on the immunotherapy and that was pretty nerve-wracking because I knew they were throwing the big guns at me. So I was quite concerned that, you know, if that didn't work, there's kind of nowhere else to go. And Professor Long told me the plan was that I would have 4 infusions of 2 of these immunotherapy drugs, and they would be 3 weeks apart. And then after that, I would have one of the drugs every 2 weeks for 2 years. And when she told me that, I kind of joked and I said, "Oh, that's not going to give me much chance of a holiday, is it?" And she looked at me with quite a stern look on her face and said, "Let's just get you through these first 12 months." and then we can talk about a holiday. So I thought, hmm, she's quite worried. So I had the first treatment, which I tolerated quite well, because you can get any, really any sort of side effects with immunotherapy, because what it does essentially is it boosts your immune system. So it kind of soups up your immune system to attack the cancer. And as a result of that, it can basically attack any part of your system. It can over— it can overrespond in any part of your system. So it's not uncommon for people to have liver problems, thyroid problems. Common thing is colitis, which is inflammation of the bowel. So after my first treatment, I tolerated that quite well. But then I went in. So before you treatments, you go and see the doctor, they check you out physically, you've had a blood test, and then the nurse said to me, "Oh, your eyes are a bit red." And I went, "Oh yeah, I have noticed they're a bit red and watery." And she said, "Oh, that's not good." So what had happened to me, my optic nerves had got inflamed as a result of immunotherapy, which kind of put the treatment a little bit on hold for a couple of days. I had to go and see an ophthalmologist. He gave me steroid drops for my eyes and he gave me permission to go ahead. So I had my next treatment and then I got a few side effects. I got neuropathy, which is, you know, like tingling in your fingers and toes and things like that. I had a really weird hearing thing. It was like the Bionic Woman. I felt like I could hear— I was in the shopping center. I could hear conversations of people that were like far away. And I had eventually then I got colitis. So all the, all the things that I had seemed to be attached to like nerve issues. So neuropathy, the ophthalmology and all that kind of thing. So once I got all that, they said to me, I'd had the second treatment. They said, no, we're going to stop the treatment. It's too toxic at the moment. We're just going to ride it out till the planned date when you were going to have your scans. And that's, oh my God, you can't take away the treatment. Like, what's going to happen to me? You know, how am I going to even try and beat this cancer? And at that point, they told me that the treatment I was getting was just to give me more time. So, you know, I was just hoping to buy more time at stage.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 24:40
How old were your children at this stage?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 24:42
They were 17 and 20, and my youngest son Oliver was just about to sit his HSC. So I'd had to sit both of them down and tell them that I had an incurable disease and the treatment I was having was just about buying me more time.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 25:00
Wow. And did you have any support around you?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 25:02
Yeah, I had— I've got, you know, brothers and friends, so my— both my parents have passed away quite a while ago, and great friendships, so, you know, I had a lot of support.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 25:15
And how did your boys actually take it themselves? As you said, your youngest was going through the HSC, but how do you feel on reflection where they were at with, you know, knowing that, you know, mum was quite unwell and had this diagnosis?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 25:30
Well, they took it incredibly well. My youngest son wasn't living with me at the time, he was living with his dad. And I think for him, I mean, I think that that was great because he wasn't seeing me every day, he wasn't seeing what I was going through, he wasn't seeing the pain. You know, I would see him at whatever, a couple of times a week but for short periods of time. Look, they accepted it pretty well actually. And I think probably because as you get to hear the rest of my story, it was quite a short period of time that I was, you know, unwell. So I finally had the scans 6 weeks after I'd had my last treatment and I prepared myself to go in and get the results. And I thought, okay, there's one of 3 things is going to happen. They're going to tell me that the treatment's working, that the melanoma is reduced, and I was hoping that they'd say you can have more treatment. The other option was, well, no, it hasn't really reduced, but you can have more treatment because your toxicity levels have dropped. And the worst scenario was, well, actually it's got worse, so we kind of don't think it's working. But what I wasn't prepared for when I went into that meeting or that appointment was that there was another scenario, and they told me that the treatment has worked and you actually have no active cancer.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 27:01
That's amazing. It's so rare.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 27:07
So in 97 days, I went from being lit up like a Christmas tree no cancer.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 27:17
Wow, phenomenal.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 27:20
Yeah, it was, it was miraculous.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 27:25
Yeah, phenomenal. What was your reaction, Anne?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 27:31
Well, I was a bit dumbfounded actually, you know, trying to accept that, because they say they use the term either no evidence of disease or no active cancer. And I go, right, so does that mean I've got cancer but it's not active? And then my head goes down, okay, so when's it going to become active? And you know, it's kind of hard to accept because it wasn't part of my expectation at all. But you pretty, you know, pretty quickly are very happy about it. Learn to accept it. Yeah.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 28:09
Yeah. To go from a very deadly prognosis to it's not there, it would almost feel like surreal. Was that actually real? Did I actually have it? It would almost be like, who gets that? That's incredible.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 28:25
Wow.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 28:25
Amazing. Gosh. And so out of curiosity, have you found since that time you would have perhaps followed other people that were on that same immunotherapy, that they have actually done really well with that treatment?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 28:42
Yeah, people are doing really well on it. There's, however, it's still only 50% of people with advanced melanoma, which is what I had, will respond to immunotherapy. So some people, you know, have respond really well like I have. Some people respond, but it's more like treated like a chronic disease, like they're having treatment every 2 weeks or every month, and they're doing that for years. So, you know, keeping it either stable or keeping it at bay. And then unfortunately, there are people where it doesn't work, you know, and people are still dying. 6 people are still dying every day from melanoma.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 29:23
Do you yourself have any feelings, maybe it's in your book, about helping it to work, you know, helping it to—
Anne Gately (Guest) · 29:34
they are looking into that. They're doing a lot of research about that. They believe that gut biome plays a part in it, and they are— there is experimentation with fecal transfer to change kind of the gut biome. So that's the one thing that, that I've heard about, but they are doing research on this at the moment to try and identify not actually why people respond, but why people aren't responding.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 30:06
Yeah, interesting, interesting. And so you must have felt like you got a golden ticket and, and life's just turned on on its head, did a 360, and now it's just done a whole nother 360 yet again. And here you have, you know, a clean bill of health. What made you decide— you could have just gone on, wow, that's amazing, I'm gonna go and, you know, travel the world, I'm just gonna go and do different things. But instead you decided to write a memoir, you decided to become an advocate and are a massive voice for melanoma prevention. What made you decide that that was the route that you wanted to go down?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 30:47
Well, firstly, I might just take you back a little bit if I can about when I got that diagnosis. I still was coping with pain. I had colitis for about another 4 months. But I also had survivor guilt, you know, like, why was it me? Why, you know, why wasn't this why didn't this work for other people? And, you know, so I also had that in the back of my head. And there were a few triggers that kind of made me go down the advocacy route. Whilst I was unwell, I wasn't working. I was meant to start a new contract job and I was just too unwell to start it. So I was looking for things to do while I was unwell. So I reached out to people who kind of worked in the skin cancer melanoma space. And I just knew I wanted to do something, but I thought, like, I'm not a fundraiser. I'm not going to go and, you know, walk from here to wherever. I always felt that my professional career would play a role in helping me, you know, have a role in whatever, skin cancer prevention or melanoma awareness. And my career has been in advertising. And marketing. So I started connecting with people who were advocates and working in that area whilst I was sick. So then once I got my positive results, or my negative results probably is how you call them, but I was being triggered by things. And there were a couple of triggers which were really significant. And the first of those was I got my no active cancer results kind of in the end of the November. In the January, both of my sons came home sunburnt and I just flipped out. Like I just couldn't get my head around the fact that they hadn't protected themselves knowing what I'd gone through and knowing, you know, what could have happened. And then I started to see people around me that knew what I'd been through, you know, posting on Instagram at the beach, sunbaking and that kind of thing. And I just thought, what's going on if people who know me intimately and knew what I went through aren't protecting themselves? Like, I wanted to understand what was going on. And then I started a new job, which was in a marketing role. And I was looking at a creative campaign and one of the executions was glorifying tanning. And I had a visceral reaction to it and I thought, my God, I can never put a message like that out into the world. But then I realized that there was nothing stopping anyone else in marketing or advertising industry to stop them from putting an ad like that out there because there are no guidelines that talk to tanning or sun protection. So they were kind of the major triggers and I started researching basically. I just wanted to get, I guess, a base of data behind me and I decided that I would start telling my story and I would go into advertising agents and marketing departments because that's where I'd had my career and I had contacts there. And tell my story and explain how they were continuing to reinforce this harmful cultural norm. So that was kind— that was the start of it. And I don't know, for some reason I just had in the back of my head when I was sick that I might write a book about my journey. And my original thought was that I would write about the fact that my journey was actually really short, like that 97 days. It was a miraculous, but I was thinking about writing a story about how it affected the people around me. And I did a little bit of work on that and I didn't kind of really love that idea. And I just started doing all this research and I realized that the story was that I was an average Aussie doing the average Aussie thing and because of our cultural norms, this is, you know, what happened to me and it could happen to any other Aussie. So that was the story I wanted to tell and that's why I wrote the book and why I do the advocacy work that I do so that, you know, the thing is that skin cancer is preventable and, you know, 90% of melanoma I think it is, is preventable. We don't have to go— people don't have to go through this. 2 in 3 Aussies will have a skin cancer before they turn 70, and more people die from skin cancer each year in Australia than die on our roads.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 35:52
That's, that's a huge statistic, that more people die from skin cancer than on the roads.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 35:59
We don't get those reports in the news reports, do we?
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 36:02
You know, we always get the car accidents. That's usually top of the news, you know, list of reports. But we never see skin cancer, and yet more people die of skin cancer. So why isn't that getting reported daily in the news?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 36:17
Exactly. Yeah. And so this is the thing that I— my point of view, and you know what I am trying to advocate about, is system change because my view is that whilst yes, personal responsibility is required, it's not just a me problem, sun protection, it's a we problem, it's a system problem. So if you go into schools, schools don't all have shade. I've been told in New South Wales that in school budgets and design, Shade is not mandatory in the budget, but covered walkway— covered areas to— so students and teachers don't get rained on is. If you look at our sports clubs, where, you know, they're still playing or training during the high UV. So sporting clubs, like all businesses under work health and safety regulations, actually have a duty of care to reduce the impacts of harmful UV radiation on, you know, their members and their players. I did an audit of 12 national sporting bodies' websites. Only 2 of them had a sun protection policy on their website. Where they had, you know, all their other safety policies, working with kids, concussion, whatever. Only 2 had a sun safety policy.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 37:57
Wow, that's amazing. And given that a lot of these ones, yet again, as you're sort of alluding to, you know, a lot of them are outdoors. You've got your netballs, you've got your basketballs, you've got your baseball. You often see, you know, the parents sitting down with, you know, getting their chairs out because they know that they're in been for a long day with the kids outside in the crickets and baseball, and, and they're out in that sun that pretty much, you know, at least half a day. Incredible.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 38:27
And the surf clubs too.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 38:29
I mean, my son actually fainted sitting in a school carnival from the sun. Was so— because they had to all sit out, no tents, and it was the final relay. And in the end, because he fainted, his team couldn't be in the relay. But it's like, what sort of logic is this when they weren't protected under a tent? I wrote a big long letter to the president of the surf club at the time. But like you say about safe policy, skin safe policy, I was a sales rep for years and years and years, and I've got already very freckly skin, but I've got terrible big blemishes all over my skin on my— and I think that would've been driving a car, you know, like a taxi driver. Do they have skin safe policy? Skin safe policies. I think there's no awareness around occupational outdoor occupations, you know, sales reps, truck drivers. What's on the sun safe policy for these transport companies?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 39:27
Yeah, well, that's right. They should all have them. And you're right, it's the— I mean, I think, you know, some of the industries where it's really obvious, like mining, construction, they have the policies, whether or not there's governance and communication, that's the other issue. You know, you can't just have the policy, you need to ensure that it's followed. But it's a lot of that, I guess, incidental exposure that you don't think of. As you say, you're in and out of a car or in and out of, you know, shops or whatever it is. And I've been interviewed, you know, a number of times now by the media. And every time I'm interviewing, if there's a cameraman there, I ask the cameraman, I say, "Is there a sun protection policy at your organisation?" "Uh, not that I'm aware of." I said, "Okay, do they give you PPE, like, you know, hats, long-sleeve shirts, sunscreen?" "Uh, no." I say, "Do they give you all wet weather gear?" "Oh yeah, we get wet weather gear." So, you know, it's— And the irony is you're not going to die of getting a bit wet, are you? No, no.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 40:35
I think raising that awareness, even just what policies might be in place but perhaps we're not aware of, and then sort of taking our sort of basic, you know, our own personal responsibility as well. What have you actually seen has been working? What differences have you seen seen since you've been in this role and working as an advocate and writing your memoir and also being in the documentary, being in the media? What have you seen is working? Great question, Maz.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 41:09
I like that one. It's on— it's on the individual level. So when I wrote this book, you know, like, I want to change Australia's culture, you know, I want to see this big global change and it's really only recently that I've learned to appreciate the individual impacts you can have. So, you know, I know when I speak to people, people who've read my book or they've seen the Conquering Skin Cancer film, people come up to me and say, I've changed, like I never go outside without a hat now, or the first thing I did was went and bought my son a rash shirt or, you know, this or that. So it's— I'm learning to appreciate all those small things because, you know, system change is so huge. But I'm impatient for that. And what I'd like to do is, you know, identify people, those people that want to make change and help them make grassroots change. So I've spoken to, for instance, in my local area, one of the councillors in my local council and asked for some shade audits to be done because there are no regulations in, for instance, on children's playgrounds that they have to put shade up. So the council can build a child's playground and not put shade. And it's only up to us, the community, to ask for it or say that it's important to us that they're going to do it. I love that you're actually going back to—
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 42:48
sorry, that you're actually going back to, you know, that time of life when it's really impactful. As you say, the skin is quite different when they're young, so really going in and advocating for, you know, that early sun-safe protection. So thank you for doing that.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 43:05
I mean, a friend of mine also told me about— she has young kids, I don't know, like under 10, and it was in the summer school holidays. They went to— one of them went to, I think, soccer camp. And all the mothers of the kids at the camp put a roster together so one of them would go every 2 hours, I think it was, to reapply sunscreen. Now, great initiative, but actually, They shouldn't have to do that because the company running that program has a duty of care to ensure that those children under their, you know, care are safe. So whilst I applaud what they did, the downfall is that your company that's running that program isn't stepping up and doing what they should be doing. Or, you know, insisting that the kids have long sleeves on, or, you know, what— whatever it might be, you know.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 44:09
Yeah, I actually think what would be really helpful, listening to what you're saying, to get this awareness in a, in a bigger way, is, is having a representative— seriously, at— if it's not at board level, it's like at P&C level for schools, etc.—
Anne Gately (Guest) · 44:27
that's responsible for safety. It's a little bit like, you know, the responsibility around diversity now.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 44:34
You know, we have diversity and inclusion offices in companies, we have diversity inclusion representatives on school councils so that the LGBTQI community plus are thought about in every decision that happens at the school or on, you know, involved in a corporation. I really think it there should be a representative for sun safety listening to this now.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 44:58
Good idea. I mean, you know, it should come under their safety, you know, general safety, but, you know, I think that that's a good point because, you know, I think it needs to be identified and drawn out because it just always falls off the priority list.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 45:17
Yeah, because there's safety around certain areas you know, in schools, but not really. There's not this dedicated focus on sun safety. And it is such a—
Anne Gately (Guest) · 45:28
can't tell you the number of people who tell me that their kids come home from a school event like a sports carnival or a camp sunburnt.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 45:39
Yes, I had very sporty kids and constantly they were sunburnt and it just used to horrify me. I love that suggestion, Mon. I think, you know, I mean, you've got someone that looks after the nutrition at the canteen with ideas for nutritious meals, you know, and we're looking at the long-term health of the kids. And so, as you say, you've got people looking at inclusion that might take up that mantle because it's really important to them. You'd only need one parent, wouldn't you, from each school that may have been affected by melanoma, mum, dad, sibling, themselves, that would take up that mantle of leadership. That's an excellent suggestion. Yeah. And in the HR team at every organisation, someone actually dedicated to that one role because there's so many ways people are exposed to the sun.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 46:30
And in schools, junior schools are not too bad. I mean, I think their sports carnivals, there's a lot of room for improvement there, but, you know, they do have SunSmart programs. But once our kids get into high school, that all disappears. And this is the critical time because they're becoming independent, they're going off, you know, as they get older they're going to the beach or to the park or whatever by themselves without their parents. They're being influenced by social media. So it's not even a mandatory in the curriculum. So in PDHPE they do modules on safety or risky behaviour. And there's no necessity to talk about sun protection, which I think is a major problem.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 47:20
Do you know another really helpful thing? I know for my children, they were both exposed to that terrible information around seeing people affected badly by drugs, and they were both sent to situations at hospital to see someone And I think the same would be helpful for someone that's to witness people with melanoma. That's not— I don't think I've not— have you come across schools that are letting people be exposed to that, letting children?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 47:51
No, I mean, schools are on my target list to, yeah, to talk with and, you know, talk to the students. Because the other unknown fact about melanoma is that whilst a lot of older people do get diagnosed with it, as you were saying earlier, because over time they've had increased sun exposure, it is actually the single cancer that affects 20 to 40-year-olds more than any other cancer. So whilst, you know, when you're 20 to 40 or whatever, breast cancer or prostate cancer or whatever might be the— probably bad term, but the trendy cancer to support, melanoma is actually the cancer they're more likely to get and die from. So whilst, you know, so it is a young person's disease. So it is, you know, totally relevant to high school students.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 48:55
So, and in sharing your story, you know, as we're sort of having to look at wrapping up, what an incredible journey that you've been through. And to use your pain for purpose and going from grit to grace and using all your background in advertising and marketing to find a way to sort of get the message out, to be in a position to, you know, help make changes in policy and looking at different avenues in a way to, you know, produce, you know, effective change. And, you know, while we want everyone to survive any kind of cancer, in this case we're talking about melanoma. You know, you talked about having survivor's guilt, you know, and I think, you know, that's a phenomenon to all people that survive situations that that, you know, otherwise, you know, would have been devastating. Clearly you've managed to make that purposeful and do something really valuable for all the community with what's happened for you. What would be perhaps 3 takeaways or nuggets of wisdom that you have found on this journey that the listeners would, you know, really be able to take home what kind of message would you really want the listeners to take away after listening to your story today?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 50:16
In terms of getting through something traumatic, I guess I— it's only just recently, I guess, that I've worked out or appreciated what got me through. Like, I just kind of thought, oh well, I did what I did, and, you know, didn't really probably understand it. But what I found was that I actually was able to tap into my psychological flexibility, which enabled me to kind of accept my situation and then move, you know, with that new reality. So you mentioned ADAPT earlier. So I've developed this framework, which is essentially, you know, what I did to get through that period of time. A is for acceptance. So that, you know, one of the biggest key things is to accept where you are now. And that's not about giving in, it's just about accepting the reality. D is for discovery of your emotions. So you're going to feel a whole lot of emotions. Don't try and push them down or hide them or whatever. Just explore them. I used poetry to do that. I wrote poetry about the way that I was feeling. So by doing that, it kind of distanced you from some of the more negative emotions as well. The next A is for authenticity, which is about acting in line with your values. So, you know, the types of things that I valued was, you know, communication and kind of bravery and family. So I, you know, was able to act in accordance with my values. Don't leave your values behind because they're the things that really ground you and help you through. P is about possibility. So just don't focus on, you know, what you can no longer do because there are still things that you can do. So, you know, I set myself a goal to compete in an ocean swim, which whilst I was unwell, I thought, you're joking, you know, you're kidding, you're not going to be able to do this. But it enabled me to get into the pool when I could, even if I, you know, was walking up and down the pool, I couldn't swim, you know. So I focused on things that I could do and had to let go of the things that were no longer I was able to do. And then the last one I've called triage, and that's about your energy. How you spend it. Think of it like a triage nurse. So, you know, do what needs to be done, what's urgent, and, you know, spend your time with those that you need to or you want to, you know. Be comfortable saying no. And I think that those things will serve you well when you're going through, you know, any hiccup in life, you know. And that's what I found, you know, helped me get through.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 53:17
I love that. What a great way to frame it up. And as you say, you can use it not just, you know, through sort of a cancer journey, but just in life in general, it's so important. And I love that you use poetry as a way to kind of get your emotions instead of— some people find journaling quite confronting. And for me, I actually use my voice recorder on my phone when I go for a walk. I've lost the ability to physically write after having 3 kids and time, but walking and talking and just having that that motion really helps. And you've used poetry. Simone, have you got a way that you use, a way to get out what's in here?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 53:56
Oh, I'm a big journaler. I'm a huge journaler.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 53:59
So I journal every day. But I did that fabulous Artist's Way program, and in fact, that was the inception of the Women's Resilience Center, was through doing the, the journaling course I did called Artist's Way. So I think, yeah, it's fantastic to think of different ways to be able to, yeah, get what's in that head, the flatmate in the head, the crazy flatmate. Mine's called Hippo for lots of reasons.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 54:25
So when Hippo's being a bit, you know, because hippos can crush, you know, that, that, that, that, um, that negative mindset can crush big time.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 54:34
So I talk to Hippo a lot and make sure Hippo is, you know, not crushing me. But the only way I do that really is through journaling. Yeah, for me, love it. And thank you so much for being with us here on the Grit Diaries today. I think you're a testament to possibility, determination, and turning purpose. Incredible.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 54:58
Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's been a lovely chat. I really appreciate it.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 55:04
And, and tell me, where can people find you, your book? Whereabouts can they find your book Sunburnt, and also the documentary, what platform is that one on?
Anne Gately (Guest) · 55:12
So you can find me at anngateley.com.au. You can find my book there, but you'll also find it on, you know, Amazon and other places. The film is called Conquering Skin Cancer. I think if you go to conqueringskincancer.com.au, you will find trailers there. It's not— it had a limited release in movie theatres at the end of last year and there are also some educational licences that you can buy for it. So for instance, you know, there's— schools could play it and there's a lot of cutdowns of it. So that's probably the best place to have a look and I think you can, you know, you can drop your email address in there and you can stay up to date with if they're releasing it in any other cinemas, yeah.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 56:02
Fabulous. That would be my first port of call is getting in touch with our schools and getting them to play that for the kids.
Anne Gately (Guest) · 56:10
Yeah. Yeah, it's very eye-opening. Yeah.
Mon & Mazz (Host) · 56:13
Thank you. Wonderful. Been great to talk with you. Thank you so much for being here and wish you all the best on your journey with what you're doing. And there's a reason why you're here. So thank you. Thank you, Anne. Thank you, Anne. Thank you for joining us on The Grit Diaries: From Grit to Grace. If today's story has moved you, share it with someone who needs a little hope. Remember, from grit we can find grace, and from grace we can find inspiration. Until next time, look for the joy, keep safe, stay grounded, And never forget that there is a strength within your own story. Take care.
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